0:00:02 – Speaker 1
Welcome to the nextTalk podcast, where we share real stories and practical advice for parenting the digital world.
0:00:09 – Speaker 2
We’re your hosts, Mandy and Kim. Mandy is an award-winning author and the founder of nextTalk, and I’m the director of nextTalk, a nonprofit organization created to strengthen families through open communication. You can check out all of our resources at nextTalk.org.
0:00:24 – Speaker 1
We’re your wives, moms and friends tackling culturally relevant topics from a Christian perspective. We’re sharing what we’ve learned and where we’ve failed. We’re so glad you’re here for this conversation. So I was talking to this mom the other day and she said, oh my gosh, we’re having all these questions about sexuality and your chapter in talk, with that Q&A section, has been really helpful. And I was like, yay, I’m so excited about that, that this mom was having all these questions and she was excited to dig in and not afraid. But I thought you know what? let’s tackle that on the podcast again. We did a long time ago. We need an updated show on sexuality.
0:01:03 – Speaker 2
Absolutely, and you know, things change so quickly and the conversations evolve. I think it’s a both and Always be referencing your book. It’s such a great launching pad. And then here on the podcast we can talk about what’s new, what’s happening, what’s changing. And I’ve got to be honest, i think that kids are asking sexual questions younger than ever before. I mean, the things that my kids have asked happened younger than what happened at your home with your kids, because the world is changing and the exposure to the online world is so much more intense. So we need to figure out how we’re going to answer these questions about sex, sexuality, marriage, all that stuff, before they ask it. Where do we stand on it? Like, know what you believe and why you believe it. That is so, so important.
0:01:46 – Speaker 1
Well, and in my mind, you know you have a couple of different responses on how you’re going to handle these questions, and I would say your first discussion is with your spouse How are we going to handle this as a family? What are your views on it? How are we going to approach this? You know you kind of have these options and I feel like we have four options. That’s how my brain works and how we can respond. One is okay, we’re all in, we accept everything, there’s no boundaries, like do what you want to do. I mean, that’s a response that we can have. The other option and I think it’s the opposite of that, you know. Option two is we can be shaming and judgmental and say things like it’s bad, don’t do it, it’s not okay. The third option we can adopt a balanced approach. Or, fourth option we can stay silent and just let our kids figure it out for themselves. They’ve got Google, they’ll get educated on their own.
0:02:37 – Speaker 2
My chest is tight with that option four letting the kids figure it out. I’m having a heart attack over here, but that is an option. It is an option, So we wanted to put it out there. But if you know us well, you’ve been listening to our podcast or you followed nextTalk, then we’re number three. You know we adopt that balanced approach.
0:02:55 – Speaker 1
Yeah, because you know we wanted to find a moral compass for them, but also we don’t want it to be rooted in shame and judgment either, and so that love component is very important, that love and truth, right. And so that’s what we mean when we talk about a balanced approach. So if you are not a Christian, that moral compass you know. As a Christian, I define that moral compass as the Bible. God gets to tell us what’s right and wrong. I don’t really get a say in this. If you are not coming from that Christian perspective and you want to take a balanced approach, i think your first thought process needs to be what is our moral compass? So what are we okay with? Is sex before marriage all right? Is sex outside of a committed relationship okay? What are the lines that you want to speak into your kids?
0:03:41 – Speaker 2
So that’s why we say that conversation starts with your spouse or whoever is parenting with you. You’ve got to know what you believe, what you feel is right and wrong, where that gray area is, or what’s black and white, because they are going to ask And it’s important for you to have a clear understanding of what you think first, before you’re trying to explain it.
0:03:59 – Speaker 1
And we wanted to really say that from the non-Christian perspective, because we know we have non-believers listening to our show and you may say how am I going to figure out this balanced approach? We don’t have the Bible as our moral compass And so, as always with anything at nextTalk, this is your family, your choice on how you handle the conversations. But from this moment on in this podcast, we are going to be dealing from this issue from a Christian perspective. The Bible is our moral compass in Kim and I’s home, and so that’s how we parent, that’s how we have conversations, and so we can’t separate that out for you, and we’re going to really dive in deep into what these conversations may look like from a biblical perspective.
0:04:37 – Speaker 2
Okay. So the question that we feel like we get a lot much earlier on than we used to is what does by mean? And is that okay?
0:04:46 – Speaker 1
So this is a great example from a Christian. How are we going to dive into this conversation? I think the step one is always to default to love. So the step one conversation looks a little bit like hey, if somebody at school is identifying as by, i need you to be kind, i need you to not bully, i need you to be respectful And please do not label yourself something that you do not fully understand. I have found that’s an initial good gut response to that question, because sometimes when we get that question, we’re not ready to dive into scripture and what it says. And so if we can have these little practical things in our pocket that we can say right off the cuff and it leads with love, i think that’s really important.
0:05:37 – Speaker 2
Yeah, that’s super important. And if you have young kids coming to you with those questions and if they catch you off guard or you feel like you’re not ready, having those little responses is key, and then knowing that you can say something like thank you so much for asking me, i am so proud of you. That’s what I always want you to do when you’re curious or you don’t understand something or you hear something new. We don’t have time to dive into it right now, but I want you to be kind and I want you to know mom’s going to answer your question And for us it’s a 24 hour rule in our home and in Mandy’s home as well.
But you really do have to circle back and answer their question. You don’t want to just say we’re going to talk about it, i will tell you, and then you just hope that they forget and you sweep it under the rug, because then you’re sending them the message that their curiosity, their questions, their concerns don’t count. So make sure that you give them a response that will hold them off for a second so you can pray about it, you can dig in the word, you can figure out how you want to answer it, but then circle back so that you can talk to them about how you’re going to address this question.
0:06:37 – Speaker 1
You can listen to the show to prepare for it. You have this little window that you’re going to say okay, how am I going to address this with my kids? So first, you’ve led with love, and that was a great initial response And I think that’s important for kids to hear. It added value because in its scriptural too, jesus taught us we should treat each other the way we want to be treated. So it’s this mutual respect for humankind, no matter if we disagree or don’t see things eye to eye, and so we’re modeling that for our kids in step one. But step two is then we really do need to figure out what does the Bible say about this? Because what I’m seeing a lot in the world is, you know, we’re doing great with this love message and it needed to happen because we had a lot of bullying going on, a lot of hate, a lot of hate, a lot of hate, a lot of hate, exactly, and so the love message is very much needed.
But now I feel like what we’ve done and what we often do is we’ve swung the pendulum so far to the love that now kids can’t figure out what’s right and wrong because everything goes Yeah. And as Christian parents, i think this is where discipleship really becomes key in teaching our kids to seek. What does God say about this? So the first thing is you’re going to have to explain to your kids what by is. They don’t even know what it means.
0:07:56 – Speaker 2
If they’re asking you probably Yeah, well, and I think this is important too, because they may have heard what kids are saying by is, but I think it’s really important to give them the actual, true definition so they understand from a baseline what you’re actually talking about.
0:08:11 – Speaker 1
Yeah. So you can just be really simple here. You can say you know it could mean a person likes both boys and girls, not just in a friendship way but in a flirty way, in both ways. And for older kids you can use words like attracted to you and you know your vocabulary may change with the age of your child.
0:08:29 – Speaker 2
Oh for sure. And then you know once you explain what that is. I know from experience that follow-up question is usually like what? Because it’s usually a new thing when they’re asking you and they’re surprised by it, especially if they’re raised in a Christian home or in an environment where they haven’t been exposed to a lot of that. So the follow-up question might be is this okay? Is this okay?
0:08:51 – Speaker 1
Okay. So when your kids ask you this, it is extremely important how you respond. So, old Mandy, i’m ashamed to admit this, but I think I would have responded with a lecture or a sermon here, which was not a good thing. New Mandy, in learning and really praying through my responses with God and saying how do you really want me to respond here, i feel like the Holy Spirit has given me a good way to respond to this question. Honey, i don’t get to tell people how to live their lives. I’m human. I get stuff wrong all the time. I make a lot of mistakes. I’m a mom just trying to figure this out. But there is one who knows all. He has gone before us. He is Alpha, he is Omega, he is Creator. He knows better than any human on earth, and so that is who we need to look to for the answers, because God is not going to lead us astray. This is where I feel like it’s really important that we don’t just spew our theology and our beliefs to our kids, but we push them into seeking Jesus.
0:09:59 – Speaker 2
That’s very, very practical, because I think a lot of times we get overwhelmed and anxious in that moment And being able to say you know what? I don’t have all the answers can be a little bit disarming and good. It creates that space for our kids to also know that they don’t have to know the answers, but we do have someone that does. And this is in that little moment where we say, go grab your Bible. I want you to look up this verse. That way you’re not shoving information down your kids’ throat But, like you said, manny, you’re teaching them to seek Jesus on their own. You’re modeling for them who to seek and how to seek, and I love that so much. It’s been very powerful in my home. There’s so many verses here. I know 1 Corinthians, 7, 2 through 3 is a great one that is in your book and that we have used. So if you want to tell your kid, go get your Bible, read this verse and then tell me what you think.
0:10:54 – Speaker 1
This is what it says. It says because there is so much sexual immorality, each man should have his own wife and each woman should have her own husband. The husband should fulfill his wife’s sexual needs and the wife should fulfill her husband’s sexual needs. I mean, listen, we want your kids to see that in black and white from God. We don’t want to just say this is what God says. This is teaching them to seek out what does God say about sexuality? And I will tell you too. I mean this verse and, like you said, there’s lots of verses we could appoint you to but I love this one because I mean it takes care of threesomes and orgies, like whatever we’re going to think of next, right, oh, mandy you have to go there yet All the time.
0:11:41 – Speaker 2
But you’re right, You’re totally right. It clearly says man and woman in a relationship. So it does takes care of it all.
0:11:48 – Speaker 1
Well, and I mean, if we really want to be very candid with our older kids too, it also talks about an equal responsibility here. Sex isn’t just for man’s pleasure, and this verse covers that. So men and women, husbands, wives out there, this should be a mutual satisfaction sort of thing. This isn’t just a two second blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
0:12:14 – Speaker 2
Did I go too far? reaching it? Did I go too far? And all the women said amen, amen, amen. Yes, i got to get my picture, oh my gosh. You are always pushing the limits. I know Gracious.
0:12:29 – Speaker 1
Well, because you know it’s important and these conversations are important. Sex isn’t just to fulfill a dude. It is not. That is not God’s design.
0:12:41 – Speaker 2
And one of the conversations that I think has gone missing from the church and from Christianity is pleasure. We think that that word is naughty, and it is not. It’s important and we need to teach our kids about what that means, because pleasure is a positive thing. It can mean joy, it can mean happiness, it can mean sexual pleasure within the confines of marriage, and we don’t want them to be afraid of that or feel like it’s scary. We want them to look forward to it. So I mean I’m all about that.
0:13:11 – Speaker 1
That sounds weird, that I’m all about that, but you know what I mean. I’m just going to say a real man, yeah, he holds the door open for his wife, but he also waits for her, if you know what I mean. Oh my gosh, all right.
0:13:26 – Speaker 2
Now we have definitely gone too far. Okay, moving on, moving on. Here’s an example.
0:13:32 – Speaker 1
This is not a counterversation for Kim’s littles, but it is a conversation for older high school kids and relationships, college age kids. This is the kind of conversations on how it evolves and changes And you have to dig into it. It’s not a one and done on the sexuality stuff.
0:13:47 – Speaker 2
Because I promise you, what we have said here today is nothing compared to what their friends are talking about and what they’re seeing online. Like this is the G version. G like G plus plus version.
0:14:00 – Speaker 1
Wait, are you talking about the G spot? Oh my gosh, you can’t say that, goodness gracious, is this going to get cut, are you?
0:14:06 – Speaker 2
going to keep this? Are you going to keep this?
0:14:10 – Speaker 1
I can’t say anything around you, not one thing, because here’s the thing I live in researching porn and researching sexuality all day long about what our kids are seeing. So my mind goes to where a 13 year old boy’s mind goes. It’s bad You have verified that today. It is bad, but we need to talk about it. And, parents, your mind needs to go there too, because that’s when you can have very relevant conversations with your kids.
0:14:35 – Speaker 2
It’s true 100%.
0:14:37 – Speaker 1
0:14:38 – Speaker 2
This show is getting really heated In more ways than one. Okay, so once your kid has seen the truth in black and white on the Bible, there’s probably going to be a number of things that happen. Number one your kid may get judgmental. I mean, that’s just a thing. They are going to have more questions. They’re going to be like okay, well, god says this, and so I have to go out there and stand up for that and preach that, and so this is very important that we address it because it happens.
0:15:03 – Speaker 1
So what I’m envisioning here are like kids in the hallway You’re going to hell. You’re going to hell. You’re going to hell. We don’t know.
We don’t know about design, so that we do not want to raise a fair cical bully. We don’t want to do that. So this is extremely important because, yes, god addresses sexuality and it’s biblical and he’s got guidelines for us. but he also addresses loving others and judgment, and so that is biblical too. And if you see your kid getting judgmental, like, oh my gosh, this kid is by, this kid is by, can’t hang out with them anymore. They’re awful or whatever. You need to take them to John eight.
It’s one of my favorite stories. It’s the adulterous woman and she’s caught in sexual sin. Now I say this because a lot of times we flippantly say sin is sin, and I agree with that. sin is sin. but listen, the Bible also says that sexual sin is a little different. Now I don’t know if there’s levels That’s a whole theological debate, whatever but we do look at.
look at first Corinthians six, 18, it says run from sexual sin. No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does, for sexual immorality is a sin against your own body. Now, when it’s not saying there that some people have incorrectly paraphrased, as is, that sexual sin is the worst sin, that’s not what it’s saying. So it is not the ultimate sin. A sexual sin is not the ultimate sin, but the Bible does recognize that sexual sin is different because there are effects in anyone. anyone of us who has experienced sex outside of marriage versus sex inside of marriage. We know the physical, emotional and spiritual consequences of that, and so we can relate to this verse because we’re like, yeah, i can gossip and I could have sex outside of marriage. Both are sin, but the sexual sin had an effect on me, unlike the gossip, and the Bible recognizes that.
0:17:09 – Speaker 2
Well, and let’s be clear here about sexual sin. It’s not just by gay, it’s male, female outside of marriage, it’s adultery, it’s all sexual threesomes. Any of that, all of it’s the same. Sexual sin is a sin against our own body and it’s clearly outlined in the Bible.
0:17:31 – Speaker 1
And I want to point that out because in this John 8 verse she had committed sexual sin, it was adultery, and so she’s brought before Jesus and all the Pharisees and the Pharisees are the religious leaders and they’re like la la la, the law says to stone her. So that’s what we need to do, because she’s guilty and she was. Jesus has this brilliant response in John 8, 7. He says you, without sin, cast the first stone. So what he’s saying there is y’all got your own stuff to worry about. Now, after they all left, it’s Jesus and the woman. Jesus was perfect. He had no sin. He could throw stones. He didn’t. He says go and sin no more.
Now I think this is key for our kids to understand, because when our kids go to this scripture and they read this story, it’s key that Jesus led with love. He loved this woman. He said basically I forgive you. Right, you are not condemned. I do not come to condemn you. But he did not say you can keep having sex with this boy. He did not say I love you, it’s okay that you keep living in sin. He said go and sin no more. And that’s important because in this culture, kids are being told that we can live in sin and it’s okay. And Jesus really calls us to turn from that. He says no, it’s not okay. Living in sin, it’s not okay.
0:19:09 – Speaker 2
Well, and it’s so important to break that down and say Jesus led with love, but there was still truth and an expectation, and I think a lot of times we forget that first part and all they see is sin and condemnation, and that is not the case. That is not the case. Jesus gives us a perfect picture of how he sees us and how we need to treat others, and I love that. He paints these pictures in the Bible in such a different way than the way our human limited minds think and gives us very specific examples that we can use in our day to day. So once your kid reads that and you break that down with them, that’s how you get into these great conversations with them. That’s how you get into this back and forth. Where they can work out their questions and their concerns is by saying God gave us the picture right here. This is what it looks like And I love that. I love that about our living word, that it’s applicable to yesterday, today and will be tomorrow.
0:20:06 – Speaker 1
Listen. The great thing about this is, you know, i’ve had parents contact me. They find out their kids are having sex. They’re Christian parents. They’re devastated, right. They’re like, oh, i didn’t want this for them. And I always say to them because they always say, what should I do? Take the car away, you know, rip everything away, like I can’t believe this is happening. And I’m like why would you do that? That’s not how Jesus responded Yeah, and it’s about hey, i love you. The same, i think this may be unhealthy for you.
I don’t know that this is the right path for you. There could be consequences. Are you worried about STDs? Are you worried about pregnancy? Are you protecting your? there’s all these conversations, right, and there’s not a. As a Christian parent, you do not have to say to your kid it’s okay that you’re having sex, but you do have to say to your kid I love you, no matter what you choose. That is the difference there, and you don’t have to condone it. You don’t have to agree with it. You don’t have to allow it in your home, obviously. You don’t have to allow sleepovers where they just get to go, you know, have fun upstairs. No, there are boundaries with that, but you can still lead with love, just like Jesus did.
0:21:12 – Speaker 2
Well, and if you set this precedence of showing them what God says about these really difficult issues, then hopefully that’s where they go when they’re struggling with something that they’ve done Like I can tell mom and I know she’s going to love me the same, but ultimately it’s between me and Jesus And hopefully that relationship there and what you’ve taught them and who you’ve taught them to seek, will lead them down a different path. We don’t want to have to drag them down the right path. We want them to choose, just like Jesus wants us to choose him.
0:21:44 – Speaker 1
I do think there needs to be. I like what you said, kim. There needs to be this wrestling in their little spirit between them and Jesus, about. You know they need to wrestle with God. Why do you? why do you say marriage is between a man and a woman? Why do you say that? And I think that’s a good thing? because then they’re working out their own faith. They’re not just picking up some robotic belief system that we’re handing to them. They are working it out with Jesus And that’s the ultimate going to be decision on I’m going to choose this for my life because Jesus wants it, instead of I’m just not going to do it because mom or dad will kill me if I have sex. Like, that’s not really what we’re going for there.
0:22:23 – Speaker 2
And that’s really the big thing. Them wanting to please us is momentary, but their choice in their relationship with Jesus is eternal, and so that’s where we want to push them.
0:22:35 – Speaker 1
Well, and I would even, Kim, I would even take that a step farther. If we’re teaching our kids that they want to please us, that’s toxic.
0:22:42 – Speaker 2
That’s just for sure.
0:22:44 – Speaker 1
It’s about their relationship with Jesus and what he wants for your life and why, why he’s put these restrictions on us. So we wanted the rest of the show here. we’ve kind of laid this out for you, a practical question of how we would handle it and how we would set this up. But from this you’re going to have layers and layers upon questions and conversations, And so we kind of wanted to tackle some of those that we’ve gotten before.
0:23:09 – Speaker 2
Yeah, So one of them. why can’t people who love each other just get married? Why is biblical marriage restricted to a man and a woman?
0:23:16 – Speaker 1
So again here, when you get these questions, i think step one in all this is to pray, because the Holy Spirit knows what your kid needs to hear. But we’re going to give you some practical responses too, on what we have learned and how to respond to this, and so maybe that will help you also as you’re praying through this. I think one of the ways that we can answer this is again taking that human approach. Well, we don’t know why We’re not God, like we are not God, and you can even say to your kid I’ve struggled with this question. I’ve asked God why he would say this. Right, i mean, humanize it.
If you have struggled and I think a lot of us have if we walked through this change in culture and we’re trying to figure out what do we believe and we’ve seen a lot of people flip-flop in their beliefs in the media, and so that confuses us as Christian women. Maybe we should flip-flop, and so we’re diving into this to figure out what do we believe here. One of the things I want to say here is moms and dads, don’t pick up your theology from somebody you follow on Twitter, just like sending your kid to the word, like you have to go to the word. You have to see what it says. You have to wrestle with this and figure out why you believe it, and are you trusting what God’s word says about it, or are you trying to change it to fit whatever you want your narrative to be?
0:24:36 – Speaker 2
Yes, for sure, oh, my goodness, for sure. And then, on top of that, please, please, please, don’t think that you admitting that you have struggled with something will lead your child down the wrong path. Parents do this all the time. They’re like well, if I tell them that I was curious about this, or I questioned this, or I didn’t understand what God meant about this, then they’re just going to feel like it’s okay for them to feel the same. Guess what? It is okay, it is okay for them to have questions and to struggle, and you admitting that gives them a safe space to do that. It doesn’t condone it Very, very different.
0:25:08 – Speaker 1
Well, amen, And like for me, I can say to my kids I wrestled with this and I dug into scripture and here’s where I land on it and this is why. And so you’re giving them the end result of where you land on this issue. But anyway, back to this question. So we’re saying, well, we don’t know why, We don’t know why he gives us restriction. Even I have wrestled and you can use Isaiah 55-8.
The Bible says his ways aren’t our ways. So sometimes in our human thinking we’re limited, We don’t have all the information. But here’s also an easy way that you can respond to this for kids at any age, And I think it just humanizes God a little bit for our kids. This is what I’ve learned to say. I’ve said hey, do you remember when you wanted Snapchat in first grade? And I said, no, It’s not because I hated you and I just wanted to make your life miserable.
You know like no, you can’t do it The other kids are doing. It was because I knew what was on Snapchat and I knew that your little heart and mind wasn’t ready for that yet. So by me saying no, not yet, it was a delay until you’re ready. So it wasn’t me trying to be mean, It was me out of love, trying to protect you, And I think when you use an example like that, they see God’s character in your character and they see him in a new way, Like a loving father not this person that’s just blowing out all these rules and regulations, but somebody who’s oh my gosh, he knows better than humankind and he’s giving us restrictions because he wants to protect us from something. So we may need to take note here.
0:26:51 – Speaker 2
Absolutely. That’s such a great example. I love that. Okay, so another question that I mean is inevitable. I get asked this from adults all the time, and so, of course, the kids are going to ask too what does LGBTQ stand for, and do we agree with that group? So the first thing that we need to do is define it for them. So, lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender and Q means questioning or queer, but most people argue that it only means queer. Now, Questioning means that a person isn’t sure, but I don’t know about you, mandy. Every time I am on social media or I’m doing research for something, there’s like 35 new things that’s added onto this.
0:27:31 – Speaker 1
Yeah, i was going to say now there’s lots of different letters and you know you can read it’s evolving. It is an evolving thing And so we just kept it general here for you. But the basic question is from your kids, you know what is LGBTQ and do we agree with, like, what is that? Because they’re going to have those questions, especially when they’re little and they start hearing about it and they start seeing pride flags. They’re going to want to know what all of that is.
And my whole thing is I always want to come from a place of where I agree with somebody first, and so that’s what I do with my kids. One of the things that I respond with right away again is that, leading with love portion, i say you know what I absolutely agree with this community, with the LGBTQ community, that no one should be bullied or treated with disrespect. And when the LGBTQ community was formed it was at a time when there was a lot of hate in the world, and so it had a good purpose to make sure that people weren’t, you know, attacked, murdered, you know, bullied. What happened? bullied into suicide, all of these things that were good And that is a good thing.
But we have to see where we agree and we also have to see where we disagree. So our views about sex and gender differ greatly from the LGBTQ community because we have that moral compass of scripture and what scripture says about sex and gender, and so we need to understand where we agree and where we disagree. But if you lead from a place of love, like I, can see where this has been helpful because it saved kids in a time where there was a lot of hate about this. But now the pendulum has shifted so far that now kids are very confused about what’s true and not as far as from a biblical perspective, and so that’s where we got to dive in and kind of dissect it for them.
0:29:23 – Speaker 2
So the way that you present that, mandy again saying to our kids you know, let’s go back to the Bible and see what God says about this in Ecclesiastes 718. Now, this is a message version. I know not everybody loves it, but I think it makes it very accessible sometimes to our kids, so it makes it easier to understand. So that says it’s best to stay in touch with both sides of an issue. Because let’s just be honest here, a lot of times our gut reaction is just out of fear.
We’ll say no, no, we don’t agree with these people and we don’t agree with what they stand for. And then we walk away, you know, and go make lunch, and that leaves our kids in a place of hate and we don’t want that. We want to show them, like you said, mandy, here’s what’s good about it, but here’s where we disagree and why. And then send them to the Bible to see here’s some scripture, like we did before. This is what we believe marriage and relationships look like. And then here’s a scripture about why we look at both sides of every issue, stay in the middle, define it through scripture. That’s really how we need to approach all difficult issues.
0:30:25 – Speaker 1
Well and honestly, the more I’ve, the more the Holy Spirit has shown me in navigating these conversations, that Bible verse, the more I’ve been able to understand it. The Bible verse is extremely important because it keeps me loving, it keeps me empathetic, and I think that’s what Jesus wants of us. Yes, we need to know truth. Yes, we need to know what is right and wrong, but we also need to again lead with love, like we’ve seen over and over again in scripture that Jesus does. Okay, so another question that we get Pre-passion about this one. But, mom, love is love. No, and you may not even be a question. It may be a statement from your kid that they’re saying to you.
0:31:06 – Speaker 2
I’m not going to say a lot here, because this one fires Mandy up. She gets all crazy up in here, which is valid, because this one can really go down a slippery slope real quick.
0:31:16 – Speaker 1
I’ve seen this one used really badly for pedophiles, and so it really does fire me up a bit. So so the love is love thing. Here’s the thing In our social media driven world, we are picking up these sweet little sentiments that sound amazing and we are making them theology. And it is super dangerous, and I’ll tell you why. You got a 14 year old kid on Instagram. She’s conversing with a person who she believes is a 16 year old boy. They’re in a online relationship. She finds out oh, he’s a 68 year old guy that lives halfway across the world. She still is okay to be in that relationship because she’s seen so much on social media. Love is love. Mom, why can’t you accept this love?
I have seen this play out in homes where parents are trying to say baby, you are being groomed. We know now, this person is this old and you are being groomed. This person could be a sex trafficker. This is not a good situation that this old of a man is talking to a young teenage girl, but the girl will continuously say but love is love. And I have seen this sweet sentiment become theology, become a belief system that is literally being used by pedophiles to sex traffic our kids. So I’m pretty dang passionate about it And I know I’m getting in preach mode here.
This is something you do not do with your kids, but I’m getting in preach mode with parents. Don’t take this flippantly. This is a big deal right here And this is a big conversation. So stay calm when you have it. But you need to say hey, i hear you, love is, love, sounds sweet, but let me paint a picture for you. Do you think this is okay in this scenario? And you explain the scenario that I just painted so that your kid can see? Oh, i can see how this can be very harmful too.
0:33:17 – Speaker 2
Yeah, for sure That’s so good. It’s very important to see beyond the sweetness of that sentiment because it can be taken so lightly and parents can miss it, thinking, oh, that’s nice. But beyond the awful thought of a sex trafficking pimp who is taking advantage of your 14-year-old. I have talked with administrators recently. I was in a scenario where I got to speak with a few and they were saying we’ve got kids having sex with animals, we’ve got kids having sex in groups and they’re saying because love is love, that’s okay. So it’s not just that, it is all kinds of situations that would blow your mind that you don’t want your kid to think it’s okay. So this one you do need to pay attention to.
0:33:57 – Speaker 1
You need to poke holes in the theology of it. It doesn’t apply to everything. It does not apply to everything because this could literally save your kid from a sex trafficking pimp. I mean, it could save their lives from that, and so it’s a very important conversation.
0:34:11 – Speaker 2
Okay. So moving on to another question that you might get Mom is there any scientific evidence to support God’s definition of biblical marriage? We’ve got smart kids. They want the science, they want the stats, they want the details, they want to know the facts about what we and they believe Absolutely, and so it’s critical.
0:34:32 – Speaker 1
And even with your young kids you can always say it always takes an egg and a sperm to make a baby. Always, it’s a very important thing to know how a baby is formed. Now for your older kids, you’re going to talk about sergosy, infertility, all of that sort of thing, and you’re going to say, even in a lab, when doctors are forming a baby to implant, it’s always an egg and a sperm. So that still matches up scientifically with what God is saying biblically. And this is an important thing to point out to them, because even if you have somebody going through a sergosy, that child has a biological sperm donor And so that is a conversation It takes an egg and a sperm to create a baby. Scientific fact.
0:35:23 – Speaker 2
So also, if you have a middle school kid or above, you need to be talking about STDs because in this conversation about scientific evidence to support the definition of biblical marriage, if they’re really wanting to know facts, this is a good one, and if you need help with that, go to our show. We did with an RN about common STDs and there’s some really good information in there. But you can say to them anytime you’re exchanging bodily fluids with someone, there is a risk of STDs. If you’re not, then you’re not going to get an STD.
0:35:51 – Speaker 1
Yeah, i mean my kids are in public school and their sex ed curriculum always comes back to you are 100% safe if you are, if you abstain right, right Abstinence, and so kids need to know that lines up biblically with what God is saying. So that’s a good talking point, like if your kids are in the public school, which mine are and they were getting that in their sex ed curriculum and follow that sex ed curriculum very closely what they’re being taught and make sure it’s good. Ours is so far And so, but I was able to bring the biblical perspective from the home into it as far as look what they’re telling you scientifically it matches up what God is asking you to do biblically.
0:36:32 – Speaker 2
Well, and also, if your kids are in private school or home school or in a school where they don’t have sex ed, you still got to talk about it. Even if they have sex ed, you still got to talk about it. Like, don’t avoid these difficult conversations, starting with marriage all the way to these conversations about sexuality and STDs. All of that is important for you to address because even if they’re not hearing it on a school campus, they’re going to hear it and they are going to have questions about it And you want to be the one who speaks into it. You want to be their Google, you want to be the one to give them God’s definition of healthy marriage and sex. And if you’re not, someone else will.
0:37:12 – Speaker 1
Yeah, okay, another question you may get are people born gay? Again, you need to go back to that human response. We are not God, we have no idea. We have no idea. And there’s a couple different schools of thought on this, okay, and so I’m just going to throw those out and they could be good talking points with you and your kids. First of all is I don’t know, i’m not God. My job is to love, you know, kind of basic thing here. The other thing is you can talk about this is between each person and God, and they have to figure this out for themselves.
You know, i’ve heard people say and this is one school of thought we’re all born with sin because we’re born into a broken world. So you know, god has knit you together in the womb perfectly, but once we enter the world, we are entering brokenness And so we are born into something. That’s a school of thought that you can talk through and talk about. The other thing is you know, i’m very practical with them and saying to them you know, we know that having sex is a choice, you know, outside of, obviously, rape, and they need to know that boundary between what is sex and what is rape.
But, for an example, if a married woman chose to have an affair with a man who wasn’t her husband, that’s sexual sin. It’s no different from any other sexual sin And no matter what feelings that she has towards this new man, she was so attracted to him. Oh, i think this is my soulmate. Oh, i married the wrong person. No matter what she’s feeling in that moment, it’s still sin. The feelings don’t change the fact that it’s not okay to have sex outside of your marriage. You know, those are the examples that I use most with my kids.
0:39:05 – Speaker 2
So, looking at it from that context, acting on any sexual attraction outside of what God defines as marriage is wrong. So someone may be born having sexual attraction toward the same sex, but acting on it by the act of having sex is outside of what God has designed for marriage or for relationship. So that really goes for all types of sex heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, pansexual, any other sexual that we’re gonna come up with in the future, because I promise there will be more. Sin is sin, it’s not different.
0:39:42 – Speaker 1
Well, and I really liked what you said, kim. You differentiated between having same sex attraction and acting on it. I think that’s really, really important, because I think we’ve done a really bad job as Christians in shaming people for admitting they have same sex attraction. We shame them And then it’s almost like we have to recognize you have this, but why is it not okay to do that? And, just like the married woman example, you may have this feelings toward your coworker at work, but that’s not okay. That’s not okay to cross the line. You have to admit that you’re having those feelings and you have to stop. You have to have self-control. You have to take those thoughts captive And a great resource for you.
Listen Jackie Hill Perry. She wrote a book called Gay Girl Good God, and she really talks about this same sex attraction and you need to read it. I mean, if you’re in the sexuality space, you’re struggling with sexuality. Your kids are struggling with sexuality. Pick up her book, it’s a great resource. Follow her on social media. She’s got some great wisdom that she shares out there and she’s walked this path of having to say I have this, but I know that God says it’s not good for me.
0:40:53 – Speaker 2
Yes, that is such a great resource. Pick it up, read it. It’s gonna give you some nuggets of truth that will help in these conversations, for sure.
0:41:01 – Speaker 1
Well, and one more thing about this question are people born that way? As culture has evolved, one of the things that I’ve really paid attention to is a lot of people are saying they’re born a certain way, so now they’re saying I’m born in the wrong body, like that’s the whole new movement, right? And so I actually think it makes it easier to have this conversation because we can say to our kids do you see that being born a certain way or being born in the wrong is an excuse to basically just do something different. It’s almost become so normal to say I was born this way, this is just how I am And that’s not how God created us.
God creates an image for us that we are born into sin and we’re flawed humans, but that every day, our goal should be to get a little bit more like him. Every day We should be evolving and changing and becoming more Christ-like. So we shouldn’t adopt this theology of well, i’m just born this way, i have anger issues and that’s just who I am. Yeah, so having those conversations, i think, really help your kids kind of dive into. Okay, what do I really believe about all this?
0:42:12 – Speaker 2
Well, and I love how, within each of these questions and each of these conversations, it can evolve into different conversations that are applicable to other parts of their life, like you just said. And so that is so good And that’s why the conversation matters. That’s why shutting it down or being judgmental and putting up that wall where they feel like they can’t struggle with this and talk and discuss with you about this is so detrimental. Because we want these conversations to evolve and we want to be able to dig into other parts of their life, beyond just sexuality. And this is how we do it We open it up, leading with love. We want to have kids who have real, authentic faith and who feel like it’s okay to talk about these hard things with us.
0:42:58 – Speaker 1
Well, and as we close here, a couple of just cautionary things that I wanna leave you with. One is if you don’t know how to answer your kid’s question, don’t make up an answer. Say I need to research this, i need to look into this more, because here’s the thing If you give them just flippant responses, this is wrong. That’s why it’s wrong. Da, da, da, da da. You lose your credibility as their source and they will not ask you because they will realize oh, i saw something on Twitter that totally contradicted what mom said, so mom’s not relevant. And so you always have to acknowledge there’s different schools of thought out there and there’s different beliefs on this. But here’s where I land and this is why. But don’t just make up a flippant answer. I mean, this is important Your kids asking you these questions. You should take this with the utmost responsibility. I don’t know what else in the world that you could be doing more important than answering your kid’s questions and helping them process their culture.
And one more thing here listen, as Christians, absolutely it’s our job to make sure our kids know what the Bible says about sex and marriage, but it is equally important that we raise loving kids, because leading with love, defaulting to love. That is biblical too. That is biblical truth. You cannot forget that. We cannot raise bullies. My heart breaks for LGBTQ kids who are feeling hate. They’re spiraling because they feel like the world hates them. That is not who we are called to be. Hate is always, always the wrong choice. Our job is to love. Thank you so much for joining us, listening and sharing our podcast. Because of you, this show is in the top 5% of over 2.9 million podcasts.
0:45:08 – Speaker 2
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0:45:19 – Speaker 1
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0:45:24 – Speaker 2
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Transcribed by https://podium.page