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After more than three years of advocacy, prayer, and perseverance, Brian Montgomery returns to the nextTalk Parent Podcast with a major update in the fight for justice for his son, Walker, who died by suicide in December 2022 after becoming the victim of an online sextortion scheme.
After more than three years of advocacy, prayer, and perseverance, Brian Montgomery returns to the nextTalk Parent Podcast with a major update in the fight for justice for his son, Walker, who died by suicide in December 2022 after becoming the victim of an online sextortion scheme.
Transcription is done by an AI software. While technology is an incredible tool to automate this process, there will be misspellings and typos that might accompany it. Please keep that in mind as you work through it.
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No matter what any family is struggling with, they can look at your story and see the power of God through the most unimaginable loss and tragedy.
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During those three years, it was a time for God to work on me and develop a faith in him that his way was going to be right. If you call yourself a believer, but you don’t believe in the supernatural, then you got a conflict there you can’t resolve because that is where our faith is stored. We had an opportunity to go to Mar-a-Lago and meet with President Trump. She gets up there and he says, the man that murdered their son, we’re going to be next to God.
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If you target American kids online, we will hunt you down and we will comfort
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you. Welcome to the Next Talk Parent Podcast. I’m your host, Mandy Majors. Together, as parents, we’re learning how to navigate tech, culture, and faith with our kids. We share real stories and real hope as we fight to keep our kids safe in a digital world. Brian Montgomery is back on the show today. Brian, thank you for being here once again.
SPEAKER_01
Oh, we have, you know, you’re you and your family and the family that we consider Next Talk has just been instrumental in our in our journey and uh everything we’ve done and um just being able to know that those people are your people are praying for us. It’s just we love you and you love we love them. So we’re happy to be here.
SPEAKER_02
Our normal listeners know who you are, they know your story, they’ve been praying for you on this journey. But if there’s a new listener out there, can you give us a brief recap of what happened to your sidewalker?
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, sure. So, you know, obviously we were uh December of uh 22 is where this started for us, but you know, we were just living life. We felt we felt like a normal family, normal kids. I mean, involved in athletics, went to a great school, had me involved in church, very just homegrown family. I mean, you know, nothing nothing out of the ordinary really in. And on December the first of 2022, uh Walker encountered a an online predator from Nigeria that was pretending to be a uh young girl that convinced him to go into a sexual encounter over Instagram, over the um what we would think of like a FaceTime type interaction there, and captured uh video of Walker in a very sexually compromising situation, then began extorting him over that for him not to send that information, uh, for them not to send that that video to his friends and family. And within what we think of as three to four hours of contact, uh, Walker committed suicide. And um, you know, there’s a there’s a longer version of that story, but you know, that launched us into what I will consider just mission of educating other people and and looking at ways to change our society and how we interact with technology and and your podcast came on. You know, you can you had you you contacted me very early on to tell our story. I mean, that uh someday I’m gonna go back and listen to that podcast because I I I expect it was pretty raw. And I didn’t know you, you didn’t know me, but um I know it reached a lot of people from that original contact, and um it was one of the things that helped, you know, your podcast was one of the ones that helped us to spread the message as quickly as it spread and to create these opportunities to tell our story and to and to interact in ways that we just never dreamed we’d be doing. Honestly, we wouldn’t have chosen this path, but um God chose us, and so we’ve been walking it out ever since.
SPEAKER_02
Gosh, that was th three and a half years ago. I remember I was walking home from a next talk event, getting in my car, and I got a clip of a Fox News article of you. And it was you talking about sex tortion. And at Next Talk, we we knew what sexortion was. We had seen it before, but what I had never seen was a kid losing their life within three to four hours from from the initial message. I’d never seen that. And I remember immediately saying, We’ve got to hear more about this and spread awareness. And you came on, it was just a couple of months after losing Walker. And um, we’ll link that show. I I don’t think I could listen to it either. I haven’t listened to it since the day we recorded it. It was it was very raw. What has been shocking to me over the years is when I get a DM saying my son woke me up in the middle of the night because they had heard Walker’s podcast. And that podcast that you were brave enough to do. And so I love when I get the opportunity to like send you those messages and say, another another kid saved, Brian, because you came on the show when you didn’t want to, I’m sure. And um, and since then, I can’t even imagine how many times you’ve had to retell the story in your fight to save other kids. So I I just want to say thank you for for continuing to share. I know it cannot be
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easy.
SPEAKER_01
I mean, I will just to kind of dig into that motive just a little more because I know we’re gonna get into it in this show, but you know, very early on, there always has been a component to wanting to help other people. But the further back you go, the more of my motivation was driven by finding a guy responsible for what we did to our fail. I mean, that’s just that’s just truth. That’s just what it was at that time. I can go back and remember that I need it. If I the more I told the story and the more that we talked about it, and the and the more that I could shed light on it, the more likely it would be that we could find that person responsible. And so we’ll we’ll get into some of that later on in the show, I know, but I just feel like it, you know, if people want to understand kind of that early on motive, it was it was to help people for sure. We really we knew we got mind-sighted in a way that that was unacceptable, you know, for us as families. And and we all we’re all in this fight together, you know, to raise kids. And and so we we understood the need to to to tell people about it, and and we saw God moving us in that direction. We was gonna do something with it special. But uh, I mean, personally, there was a lot of that in the background that was intended to end up in a certain place.
SPEAKER_02
If I remember correctly, very early on, I mean, obviously it didn’t make sense because Walker had no mental health issues, no red flags, he wasn’t struggling. He was a great popular kid with a lot of friends, great football player, doing great. And you got the FBI involved, obviously, to go through the phone. And early on, you knew that it was a predator from Nigeria. Is that correct? Like they were able to pinpoint that pretty fast.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, so we, I mean, just kind of the general progression, which was, I mean, I, you know, I really looking back, and even then, I could can’t brag on our local law enforcement enough. I know that’s not always the case. You and I both know we’ve talked to so many families that struggle with local law enforcement to help them through this process when it’s like this, because they understand law enforcement generally understands somebody that’s walking down their local streets and how to apprehend them and how to find them and how to protect the public from them, but they really struggle with this segment of of crime. Uh but I’ll say that our local, so it started with our local, we live in the county with our local sheriff’s department. So we live in in Lowndes County. That’s where we physically live, and that’s where um that’s where this all happened. My business, we go to school, everything else in Octibah County and really Startwell, Mississippi. And so very early on, the Lounge County, they have they have a tech guy that’s really good at figuring out what’s going on. And so when I say very early early on, within about a month, it wasn’t that quick, but it was, you know, it was I mean, there was a month there we had no idea. We had no idea, could not make sense out of it. I mean, I always said that it the Hans would be on the phone from the very morning we found Walker. But um the Lowells County Sheriff’s Department, they recovered the mess some some messages uh pretty quickly. And then our Starkville Police Department also has a has a tech guy um that’s that’s really good. And they had had some some some other reports of sex tortion in Starkwell uh in the school district, and so uh they requested Lyndon County to send them the evidence, Walker’s phone, and then they extracted more messages and more information off of it. At that point, they contacted the FBI. So you see these these law enforcement agencies sharing information, escalating the case to people that are more capable than not getting you know this this idea of I want the credit, you know, they weren’t protective at all. They wanted to sob it. They wanted to fix they wanted to find who was who was responsible. And so I it I’m telling you that just because I want anybody that’s hearing this that may have a connection to law enforcement, that that’s the right way to handle it, you know. And I hear so many other people that are involved in those kinds of situations say, well, that’s not how they handled it here. The sheriff’s department wouldn’t give it to the police department, or the police wouldn’t give it to the FBI, they wouldn’t escalate because they want to solve it themselves, you know, and they never they never had that situation. And I think that’s part of what’s what led to you know successful apprehension of this guy.
SPEAKER_02
But well, and I know that that early on you and I have had conversations, finding out that this alleged predator was halfway around the world, you had hesitation that he would ever be on American soil to face justice.
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And that’s kind of the breaking news here that that it he has been. He’s been extradited and you faced him in court. And so I I want to talk about that process, like what led to him appearing in a Mississippi court, and then also like I want to know how you felt when you saw him for the first time.
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So just to kind of give you the time light of how things transpired on our side, what we knew, you know, I don’t know if you remember, but probably it wasn’t on the first podcast, I know, but within we did another subsequent podcast there, kind of probably three or four months after that first one. And um and pr pretty much every time I’ve appeared anywhere, people people always want to know, well, what do you what what do you think about the guy that did it? Are they gonna be able to find him, you know? And and I mean my response was always that the FBI is confident that they that they’ll that this will end in an arrest. And so they obviously didn’t want me talking about what I knew at that time, but what I knew is that they had identified somebody. They identified had identified through through the warrants, through truly the cooperation of the Nigerian government, their counterparts over there, um, they had identified this this guy as as the suspect that did it. And um, so that I would say that conversation with them happened I’m I’m not I don’t know exactly, but it was within mid-summer of that year that they communicated to Courtney and I that we’ve we feel like we know we we we know who’s responsible. We know where the information leads, we know where the IPU address originated from, we know, we know who it is. Of course, you know, you get to that point and you’re like, okay, well, we may know who it is, but I mean, it’s Nigeria. I mean, how do you find that person? I mean, just, you know, for us, we think of that, and and I think rightfully so, we think about that region of the world as corrupt, as disorganized, as chaotic. What are the odds that that we could actually number one, find the guy, but number two, have him arrested, and then number three, have him extradited back to the United States. You know, those those steps and that, I mean, they’re they’re they get m more and more unlikely the further you go down that list. And so But we knew pretty early on then they they had somebody. Well then whenever they brought up brought that information to us that they that they had him identified, they said we’re planning a mission to go over there. Uh there’s other uh criminal targets that we’re gonna put put together all in one all in one um in one mission, and we’re gonna go over there as the FBI, and with our FBI, I mean with our contacts in Nigeria, we’re gonna we’re gonna round these guys up. And our number one target is is Walker Sky. We knew that as early, probably as July of 23 was generally the timeline. And then so then it was trying to get that scheduled, and when is that gonna happen? Well that that ended up happening in in August. And you know, the anticipation was we’d go over there, we’d get him, we’d apply for extradition, it would be pretty fairly quick, you know. And then they they called us, you know, August, so they were headed over there, and we were in pretty close contact with our with our FBI comment, with our FBI, you know, investigator who was over the case, uh Molly Blythe. She’s she was, I mean, I mean, she would become part of our family. I mean, she cares, she loves us, she wants, she wants the resolution, right? I mean, she’s she’s that she’s just that kind of person. I mean, as far as I mean, I don’t think we could have we could not have encountered somebody within that organization that would have been that would have been better. You know, she kept us updated. You know, when she got there, they had trouble finding him, and then she was getting, I mean, she was there for I think almost three weeks. You know, and and finally, very at the very end of her trip, she texted me and said we got here. And of course, I mean, still I mean, every every step of this has been just like a I don’t know, it was the tidal wave of emotions. But at that point, you know, knowing that he was in custody and that it it that was a major milestone, you know. I mean, that that was at a point where we’re okay, this this is possible, you know. Still a lot of steps to go through, but it’s possible. That would have been in in in August of 23 is when that would have happened. And then we went on the long journey of extradition, which I mean took almost three years to the day, literally, to get him to get him back to the United States to stand trial.
SPEAKER_02
Tell me what that felt like the day in court, because that just happened a couple weeks ago now. And it’s pretty raw. I I know.
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Yeah, it is. You know, you know, between that time and actually I I think, you know, you know, there’s no secret, we’re we’re Christians, um, we’re followers of Christ, and it’s interesting just how how God moves and and how he prepares you for certain events. You know, if you it you know, because what I wanted to see happen is you get arrested and he’s here, you know, right away. And if I don’t know, I just think I think my reaction in that courtroom would have been completely different if if if the timing would have been anything different than what it was. And God knew that and he protected us from things that that whether it’s just the way we deal with it on a daily basis or you know, the physical reaction in that in that courtroom, you know. During those three years, it was a time for God to work on me and develop a faith in him that his way was going to be right, regardless. That my way was not gonna be right, and his way would be right. Over the course of that three years, you know, there was a lot of frustration, a lot of starts and stops, a lot of lack of communication, a lot of I mean, you can only imagine. I mean, you’re dealing, it’s not our it wasn’t our people’s fault. It was it was just the system. And I then looking back, I’d realized that it was just simply God saying, okay, you need we I need to refine you more so you understand that this is about me, this is about my timing, this is about my faithfulness. And he did. So by the time we got to that courtroom, um I mean, for me, you know, the the interesting thing is, is, you know, I got to my I’ve got to imagine with access as public as we’ve been about Walker’s story, that that he’s had three years. The guy responsible for this has had three years in jail in Nigeria. He knew who we were. But we had no idea who he was. Had never sent a picture. We had a name, and I can tell you that name don’t exist there’s not a picture associated with that name on the internet. I can tell you, because I tried to find it. It’s not there. As far as I can ever find. And so that was important to see who he was. I mean, what what’s what’s this what is he? Who is he? You know, and and and hadn’t seen that until we walk until I walked into that courtroom. And um, you know, at first opportunity to see him, he saw me, he turned away and looked the other way. It was again just another flood of emotions that I that was that was at a different level that I’ve ever experienced in my life. I mean um I guess the best way I can describe it, it felt like every cell in my body was was vibrating. You know, just it was uh so difficult just to be in that same room with him and just be there. Um and to have my family there um and to know how much pain that person, that individual has caused. It was uh yeah, it was hard. It was really hard. It was um like I said, something that I’ve never experienced and I hope I never do again.
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Yeah, I know, I know for me on the outside, I was just like justice for Walker, right? And I was texting you about that and um and you responded with a lot of emotions, and it just made me pause because just imagining you know, we’ve talked so much about this online creditor, this darkness that came into your kid’s room and terrorized your kid, and we never had a face to put to it. And um it was I’m so happy that he’s here and uh you know he’s the alleged perpetrator, he will he will face justice and through due process to see if he is guilty. Um but man, I can’t imagine you guys having to kind of relive everything on another level, like like you probably had to.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, like like you said, I mean, it’s uh it’s so hard to be so happy and so sad at the same time. I mean, it’s I don’t know, you know, I don’t know who’s experienced that. I’m sure others have. Then all the questions, okay, what’s next, you know, what’s I mean, we’re constantly, we’re constantly, you know, thinking through that is, you know, what if he what if he don’t well they don’t find him guilty? What if the evidence, I mean, you know, we’re confident that the evidence is there, show that he’s the one. And obviously a court believed that too, or they wouldn’t have, you know, wouldn’t wouldn’t have uh signed the arrest arrest warrant. So yeah, I mean lots of questions still. But um You know, we just know that again, it’s that time that it took for God to to welcome our heart to give us faith to know that okay, whatever happens, it’s it’s gonna be okay.
SPEAKER_02
You know, you and I did a show I don’t know, Ben, but but it was going through grief. And we talked about how you had to go on. You had other children, you had your wife, you had your work, all these responsibilities that you had to go walk through and still do a good job while you’re grieving. And from my standpoint, it’s just been kind of inspiring for lack of a better word. I mean, it’s just it’s just been inspiring to see you get to a place where you had peace and everything wasn’t fully reliant on this alleged predator facing justice. Like you had to find peace in that. And I think that goes back to what you said, these three years of waiting that God was showing you something, which is amazing that you can say that and not be so bitter about it, that it took so long.
SPEAKER_01
Well, I think that’s you know, uh what I would tell people, you know, is that we were, you know, waiting in furs, and I s I used a word, so waiting in furs that we were setting, you know, passive. But that’s that’s really not what was happening. I mean, he God was laying opportunities at our feet every day to be active. And and I and I guess that’s what I really want people to hear is that there was a progression of day one when I found this out. I said, I don’t care where I have to go, what I have to do, this guy’s gonna pay for it. Exactly. Exactly what I what that was my motive 100% from when I woke up to when I went to sleep. Um I had a friend of mine this weekend, he reminded me, it was a small group of us in a ring, and we were just talking about this. Was like, this was actually before we knew what had happened to Walker. And we, you know, just we had heard of things like this at that point. Once we started talking about like what could it have been? You know, I can remember, you know, again, I went back to it, it’s gonna be on his phone. I just there was no other explanation. We knew Walker, I’ve told y’all this a hundred times. We knew him what kind of kid he was, what he did, how was matter of the war. I mean, we spent so much time together as a family, we were a close family. Wasn’t there was no there was nothing there that would have inferred anything normal, you know, like to think about that would have caused somebody to do this. And so I mean, but I could remember us just talking about it, and I and I and I our pastor was in the ring, and my friend reminded me of it. He said, you know, because I I remember saying it, and I said I’d have forgotten to say it, but I said, you know, if somebody’s responsible for this, hell don’t have the power to keep me from fighting it. So that was that was before I even knew what happened. And so once we knew what the deal was, that was that was on steroids, that mentality. And I won’t I mean I really I’m not necessarily I’m not advocating that, I’m just I just want people to understand where I really was because I want people to see the the infinite power of the God we serve to be able to take to let me have that perspective, but give me the tools to at the same time from I don’t that motivation may have been call it whatever you want to call it. I don’t care, but that motivation was used to make change, and so he kept me busy with that. He gave me opportunities to pursue that, he gave me opportunities to tell people about Walker, and in the same time where my heart may have been, it was partly there, but it was also partly and a big part towards finding this person. And so there’s a lot wrapped up in that. And I I I don’t know that I can completely communicate all that, but I guess for the person out there that their hearts somewhere do something else, God will put something in your lap to help use that to move the needle for the kingdom and to move the needle to help families, to help people, to help kids, to help a counterpart, whatever you fill in the blank. Because we’re all facing different hardships, different difficulties. And for me, that was that was it. I mean, I’m just being honest.
SPEAKER_02
Well, you were motivated to find the person responsible, allegedly. Um and that motivated you to change. God opened doors and you had to take steps of obedience to go through those doors. But in the whole process of that, it’s like you’re telling me God was changing your heart so that that God is responsible for the justice and not and not you, not all on your shoulders. And how much like this as people, as especially as parents, to want to be the protector of our kids and and everything when we get to these moments when God says, These kids are mine, like I got it. You gotta step, you gotta let me deal with this right now.
SPEAKER_01
I know it’s over and over, and we’re slow learners on one hand. But I think in that, I think in that process sometimes, I mean, look, God is constantly refining our character and our faith and all the things. I mean, that we see over and over as a picture of this refining fire that burns away the impurities and and fire is painful and all those things. You so many analogies go along with that, but it’s it’s over and over in scripture how we see that. When you understand that, and I did understand that, you know, I would say I understood that concept previously, you know, it became a first-person understanding, you know, after this. I just I just want people to understand that it there’s so much there’s so many other layers of what of what God’s doing in these circumstances than what we understand at the time. And so the faith in God to say, I mean, bottom line is God He loves us. He loves us. And if He loves you, He’s gonna do the best thing for you. It may not feel like the best thing. It it will be ultimately. You know, we I just this morning sent a note to somebody that’s was in a very well, I think his son was saying in the exact same situation as Walker and talking about the idea around, you know, can does does God grieve for us? And I go back to where Jesus, you know, went to the tomb of Lazarus and I mean it’s it’s very simple, short passage, but Jesus wept. Well, why did he why did he weep? I mean, why did he cry? I mean, he was fishing to raise Lazarus from the dead. Well, he was weeping because he sees the pain that the people he loved had to go through in order to achieve the purpose of bringing people to Christ and showing showing his power. That’s the short answer. And I mean that brought me a lot, or very early on, that brought me a lot of peace in that, okay, I’m not in this by myself. You know, he’s not absent and just saying you gotta deal with it. Um he’s not that kind of he’s not that kind of father. He’s the kind of father that that sees the pain legitimate. And that although he wants to just fix it, he re he knows the bigger story is that I’ve got you’ve got to go through this in order to be useful, in order to be used by me. Am I thankful for what we’ve done and what we’ve what we’ve had to go through? I mean, on one hand, I could say we are, on another hand, I could say I never, I never could have chosen, you know, this path.
SPEAKER_02
We talk about you taking steps of obedience through this last three and a half years of motivation. And I know you would get a call at a moment’s notice and need to be in DC two days later, and you would have to rearrange everything. Talk about that as far as you seeing God open doors for you to share Walker’s story and raise awareness with all levels of our government here. You know, you had to be obedient to that. You could have said no. But you but you kept walking through. But but tell me about kind of that journey, your advocacy work in DC, your your meeting with politicians, your um everything that that led us to where we are today with this alleged predator appearing in U.S. court.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, I mean, once, you know, once I started uh doing podcasts and speaking a lot, you know, um of course Maureen, she’s been like a mentor in that space for me and great uh family friend as well. And um she has and she’s committed her life to changing uh laws and to creating legislation that would protect kids. I mean, just a a jacket in this space, in my opinion. So, I mean, start it off, she asked me, you know, to to come to DC with them. And look, they have they have gone multitudes of times more than I have, but whenever we started going, it was clear that, you know, there was there was a need for um somebody to meet politicians in a place that number one, as a man, there were there weren’t hardly there weren’t many dads in that space, especially at that time. Still not many compared to compared to your moms. It’s it seems to be it seems to be driven about eighty per eighty or ninety percent, you know, of of moms that are willing to go to DC and and advocate. You know, I and I think that I think it just needs to be balanced. I think that a lot of these politicians are they need they need somebody on the other side of the table that that is that they can relate to, that can put it in practical terms, and there’s a lot of the a lot of the advocates that I’d tell you the the other, you know, Julianne, Maureen, they’ll they’ll call to the carpet and they do a great job. But it’s just something about having having a, you know, having both sides of that table, you know, both sides of the story, and the table is we found to be pretty important. So I saw that that I could help. And whenever I saw that, I just that you know, like I said, it hadn’t been that many times, but we had we had big a couple times a year I would go and and we were advocating for the Kids Alive Safety Act, which puts a reasonable do you care on tech companies to protect kids. That’s that’s really the basis of it is is you know, we’re not trying to we’re not trying to prevent protected speech, we’re trying to prevent predators from reaching our kids. It’s that simple. And um and so working through that, it’s been a real challenge. It’s been, you know, it’s been a it almost seems like it’s goes in one ear and out the other at times, but um anyway, we started doing that and and um meeting with senators, meeting with you know people in the you know, lawmakers in the house, and um, you know, we knew we needed to get to a to a you know some some higher levels to to have some influence. Uh we this spring we met with Mike Johnson, his office, and him personally. Uh it was a great meeting. You know, he’s on the house side, you know, is in a position to bring the Kids Aline Safety Act for a vote. And uh we met with him. We had an opportunity to go to Mar-a-Lago and meet with President Trump, which is a direct correlation, I believe, to the extradition. Uh that’s a that’s a great story, you know. I mean, it’s it’s another step in this process, right? You see God just like he does. I mean, he’s he could change hearts and minds and create conversations that you just weren’t weren’t weren’t preparing for, but you see where his hands all over it, you know. So Lynn Shaw is with Lynn’s Warriors, um, and she’s does a lot of advocacy work. She contacted um Maureen and me and some other some other uh families about going to Mar-a-Lago and potentially with the hope to have a conversation with President Trump about the Kids Line Safety Act and why it’s important. Of course, uh Courtney and I were like, yeah, we’ll we’ll be glad to go and uh be a great opportunity to to maybe uh because we know we knew that they still do know that we need we need someone at that level to be able to support us to be able to get that bill passed. And so we get there uh that weekend, it was we woke up Saturday morning and it was the week the the first bombing of Iran. And we’re like, well, if he is at Mar-a-Lago, he’s not gonna be wanting to talk to us. You know, he’s gonna have his plate completely full. So we get to breakfast that morning. They said, Well, he is here. Um, we’re gonna continue with our normal action. We didn’t have a scheduled meeting. The hope was is that we could encounter, you know, some time there. We had a connection there. Lynn was connected to the family and to them, which which allowed us to be a guest at Mar-Laco. We go about our normal day that day, went to Mar-Laco, had lunch, we saw the president cross, you know, walk across the courtyard, but of course he was had an entourage of decision makers trying to, I mean, they were, you know, dropping bombs. They weren’t worried about us, you know. So still our prayer was that we would get to encounter him. The plan was that if we could, just for him to hear our stories, you know, and at least, you know, connect who these families are that have lost so much um to tech. Well then the plan was for Sunday morning for us to get up and go play golf at Trumpet International and just make a round of golf and then hopefully go back to Mar-a Lago that that’s that Sunday. And we did, got up, went. Well, then they tell us that he’s committed to to at least meeting us in between meetings that afternoon. So we could double lunch, and of course, you know, the the intent there was had nothing to do with our personal situation at all. I mean, we’re s with that point in Walker’s extradition in in the guy’s extradition for Walker’s Walker’s situation was it had come to I mean, look, there were some great people that brought us all the way to that point that were constantly checking in with Nigeria because at that point he had he had appealed his extradition and gone back into the cycle for court. I mean, that had been two years that he had been in that cycle of bid that the case needed to be heard again in front of a judge, and the judge looked to evidence again and grant the extradition because he had appealed. He had already already been approved for extradition, appealed it, and then had to come back into the court to plead a k uh, you know, a case that he didn’t want to be extradited extradited back in the United States. And it had just hit, I mean, ground zero. There was no communication from Nigeria. We started, I started getting worried that he wasn’t even still in jail because it really got very like eerily quiet in terms of what the response was coming out of Nigeria. And and of course, you know, we were at that point, then I was reaching out to some of some of our political relationships that we had formed over the last two years, you know, saying, hey, can you help us figure this out? And they were doing the best they could, but they couldn’t get anything out of Nigeria that Nigeria wouldn’t give up. And so we were at a at a standstill in in the extradition at that point. And so I mean at that point, if you said, Brian, you got five minutes to spend with President Trump, and what are you gonna talk to him about? If you ask me personally, that’s that’s where that conversation would have led. You know, if it’s just about you, what are you gonna ask him about? That that would have been in aid help with this. We were not there for that. And um no way I would have used that as a personal time to try to you know ask for anything other than just try to promote what we were there for, which is to get the Kids On Insecity Act passed.
SPEAKER_01
Finally, uh Trump had been you know, President Trump had been busy all day, and he finally had a chance to swing by where we were, and um very sympathetic to what we were there for, just as he is, you know, just I mean, he makes you feel like you’re the only person, you know, on the planet, even though he’s got really important things to do. And so, but he asked, he said, Do you all want a picture? And um, of course, we said, Yeah, sure, we’d love a picture. So y’all went to the kind of the the main area of of the um Mar-a-Lago, and we go in there and we’re in line, and Seacorps Secret Service is there, and they’ve kind of given us giving us some instructions about what to do, what not to do, you know, just you know, don’t give him anything, just take your picture here. I mean, they’re literally waiting on him for the next meeting, the generals, Marco Rubio, the whole, the whole crew is there, chief of staff, everybody’s there. And I mean, they’re standing 30 feet away, you know, really just waiting on him to get through with us, you know. And so you could tell he was in a hurry. Anyway, so we start, and the and the plan was we’ll just go through the line. I mean, they had to instruct us, hey, don’t even don’t in don’t engage him on the Kills of Line Safety Act. I mean, just this was just the time for him to meet us, get to know who we were, and move on. It was just take a picture and and go. And so we’re going through the line to take our picture, and and that’s what had happened to every other family in front of us. And uh we get we get up there and I just I shook his hand. I said, Mr. President, I just appreciate everything you do for us and the country or and thank you for for what you do. And Courtney got on his right, I got on his left, and um he took the picture and we started to started to walk off. And again, I just said, Hey, Mr. President, again, I appreciate everything you do. And I started to walk off, and he’s like, he said, So was it your son or daughter? And he had his he had nasty real details from anyone else. And uh, so I I was kind of a little bit surprised, and I said, Well, it was our son Walker. And um he says, Well, what happened? I said, Walker was a victim of sex tortion. Um And he said, Well, who did it? I said, It was a man from Nigeria. And he kind of shook his head and he said, That I don’t know, he said they’re always from Nigeria. He said, Why are they from over there? I said, Well, there’s just there’s evil all around the world, Mr. President, there’s a lot of them there. My best explanation, I don’t know. And um he says, he says, He says, Well, what happened to the guy that did it? I mean, it’s as though you gave him a script. And I mean, the whole time I’m thinking, I’m trying to, I don’t want to make a spectacle, and I don’t want anybody to think that I’m trying to ask something personal, because I what? Because we were gonna take our picture and just go to the next step, right? And he says, Well, what happened to the guy? I said, Well, he’s he’s still in jail in Nigeria. We’re trying to get him extradited, but we we can’t we can’t get him extradited. We’ve had trouble getting all that done. He kind of just sat back on his heels, and you know how he would kind of shuffle and he kind of shuffled and kind of you can tell he’s thinking. And he said, Well, I can get him back. I can get him extradited, and he points out in the crowd, he said, Margo, and he waves to Margot. She comes, Margot Martin, which is one of his one of his staffers. She comes walking over there, and he’s I mean, now it’s kind of turned to a little bit of a spectacle. He says, Um, if Margo can’t get him back, she’s fired. You know, he was joking, of course. It it was a crazy thing.
SPEAKER_02
Sounds like Trump.
SPEAKER_01
It’s him, I promise you, it’s him. You know, and he he kind of chuckled. He was the you know, he was joking. Margo come walk up, you know, she’s like, What? What is what’s going on? And uh she gets up there and he says, the man that murdered their son, we’re gonna be an extra diet. I mean, it’s I I can’t tell you or the audience anything other than I just know that God’s handled us directly in that. And um it was um so from that point, we just I start to walk off again. He grabs me again. He says, Hey, I just want you to know I’m sorry. He says, You seem like such a nice family. And I just thanked him and we moved off to the side. And Marg took our information, she texted me before I left, introduced us within a day to the to the White House um uh chief counsel, and then from there to State Department contact, and he sent some letters. I you know, I don’t know all the background stuff that was happening. I I don’t maybe all of it’s a coincidence. I don’t know. But he started communicating with Nigeria. Also, Nigeria starts communicating information back to the FBI, starting the updates again. Next thing you know, within six weeks, we get we get um notified that that they’ve approved his extradition and and the ball’s moving even. And so I I don’t know, um, but I can tell you the correlation is that um that meeting it changed, you know. What did we Ocadia extradited at some point in the future, maybe? You know, I don’t know. I don’t know what the background I feel like we probably would have at some point. I know that conversation was it was very um I think Courtney and I wrote almost every detail down right after the meeting just because it was so crazy. I mean, it’s you can’t make it up.
SPEAKER_02
Were you hopeful that night after that happened? Were you and Courtney like, okay, this could really mean that he gets extradited? Like you were very hopeful that this is this is it.
SPEAKER_01
I mean, we saw that. This is how we saw it. I’m sure people could say this is not what it was. You know, we were there, we didn’t know what could come of it, but we had dozens of people praying for that meeting, right? And I don’t know, it’s just like for us, you could not you’ll never convince me until I die that God didn’t say, okay, it’s time. Now it’s time. You’ve given it to me, your heart’s moved to the right place. Let me show you what I can do. You know, I you know, I’d love to know President Trump’s perspective of that day, you know, how that, you know, how that felt to him, you know, what what he was hearing, what he was feeling, you know, in this conversation with me and Courtney. And uh, I’d love to know his perspective because, you know, the questions he asked me, those were plans. It would be it would have been as though a best friend said, Hey, this is what you need to ask, Brian.
SPEAKER_02
This is what you would have wanted the president to ask you to get the information, but you weren’t there for that. So you were like, I’m just gonna promote Kids Online Safety Act. This is not about us. And and then a door was open.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, 100%, no doubt. So to ask your question about after the meeting, you know, at that point, I mean, as far as I was concerned, he was here because God had brought us to this point, and you know, it was that it was no doubt in my mind that that was a supernatural intervention of God. And there’s no way he brought us to that point. He was just gonna let this thing die. I mean, so yeah, we were very encouraged. We we knew that it was gonna happen.
SPEAKER_02
What I love about you. Giving us all these details, just me listening to the some of the behind the scenes, is from day one with your local law enforcement, had a tech guy, and all the way through your your FBI agent that was assigned to you that you said has become like family, and now you opening all these doors for you to get at a higher level of government to get this done. Like you can see God’s hand in all of this, just like you’re saying, throughout all of these levels, throughout all these last three and a half years.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, Miss, it’s as though, you know, he says, I can walk and chew bubblegum at the same time, Brian. I can, I can create a system here where you reach others for me, where you tell other people who I am, where you tell other families how to protect their families, where there’s this great, greater good that comes out of this. At the same time, I’m gonna use all of those activities to end at this other place too. Both of those things are happening. These are not separate. And so that can apply to anything. I mean, that can apply to anything in life. I mean, there’s our motives and our goals and our aspirations and wants and desires and all those things. And God can say, I’m gonna achieve those things, but at the same time, as you walk those things out, I’m gonna reach the people that are adjacent to you for my kingdom, for my work. It’s because I love you and I love them. And so when we start to understand God’s direction that way, it changes how we live
SPEAKER_01
life. It changes how we interact with other people, it changes the way that we connect to other people. And I greater more than anything else, I want people to hear that. Because our story is that’s what our story is really about, in my opinion.
SPEAKER_02
No matter what you’re walking through, you’re seeing God’s hand weave in all of it and do all of this work, and then also at the same time doing a work in your heart where you are saying, I’m gonna hunt that guy down to okay, I need to let everybody do their job and let give justice to God here and the authorities.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, that it’s it’s that’s it. I mean, that’s it. And to use your word, I mean what the word I use routinely is supernatural. And I think that look, I think we all, I think without a supernatural connection to God, we think of God, we don’t think of him as real. As a Christian, our faith is in the resurrection of Christ. There’s nothing more supernatural than that. And so if you call yourself a believer and a follower of Jesus, but you don’t believe in the supernatural, then you got a you got a conflict there you can’t resolve because that is where our faith is stored in that supernatural act of resurrection. Because if resurrection didn’t happen, all this is just a big lie. My point in saying that is that typically we avoid thinking about that those supernatural events, but I’m telling you that they’re part of our faith in a way that I think they’re a necessity for us to grow and for us to do, for us to understand who God really is. Otherwise, he’s just a rulemaker.
SPEAKER_02
And no matter what any family is struggling with, they can look at your story and see the power of God through the most unimaginable loss and tragedy in how God carried you through that and how He helped you get through it. And I just think that’s so beautiful. I’m sure like Walker’s friends, they are watching you guys, your your kids are watching you and Courtney and how you’ve handled this grief and this tragedy. And it’s just beautiful to see God shine through you guys in the middle of all of this.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, it’s been that’s been a fun journey. You know, I think that all that you just said, you know, I was really kind of thinking about, you know, even this legislation, legislative, you know, um slant on what we’ve tried to get done. I think some people think that that is very, you know, that that’s that that’s just a set of rules that these that these businesses are gonna follow. And I think that’s probably right to a degree, but you know, my hope is that through this work, in that same vein of what’s God doing behind the scenes, what’s he working on behind the scenes, you know, there’s behind everything we’re talking about, behind every company that’s gonna be regulated, there’s a body of professionals that are managing those companies. What would I rather? I would would I’d rather them be be coerced by regulation to do the right thing, would I rather than be coerced by the Holy Spirit to do the right thing? Well, I would rather then be following in Christ, and then they will do the right thing naturally. Now, do we believe that that’s the only way that do we believe that that that everybody will follow in that structure? No, we don’t. Which is why we need regulation. At the same time, God can do both things. He can work in both atomus, he’s not limited. And so um, do I think that legislation is going to solve all these problems? I don’t think so. I think that I think it’ll be some guidelines. I think it will help tremendously. But at the same time, or really more so, I prefer that that these people come to know Christ to do the right thing voluntarily.
SPEAKER_02
One of the things that I love about this story of this alleged predator being extradited. Yes, we get justice for Walker. Yes, this person gets to hear the unimaginable loss that he caused in your family. But also I love that it sends a message that if you target American kids online, we will hunt you down and we will comfort you. I think that’s such an important message that we sh need to get out there for anyone trying to take advantage of our kids online.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, I think that I think there’s a lot of things there. One, I think it what I so just to back up, I hope it motivates local law enforcement to say, you know what, I you don’t I don’t have to just throw my hands up in the air and say they’re halfway around the world. Because I don’t know how many situations are out there where if it hadn’t have got escalated to this situation that it did, I don’t think that that that we would be seeing the same opcode. And that starts with people caring. I mean, the people in our community loved, saw us, knew people that knew us and loved us and wanted wanted this. They were attached to it, you know, because because of because of our family and because of Walker. And Walker, like I said, I mean, he so many people knew and loved it. But there’s so many families out there that may not have, you know, that social connection. I want those people to experience justice. And so I wouldn’t I would hope that this would encourage local law enforcement whenever they hit roadbox to go to the next level and keep after it, don’t quit. Um but for the predators out there that are doing there’s somebody in the same situation Walker’s in right now. There’s somebody out there right now going through the exact same thing Walker went through. And there’s a guy on the other end of the screen that is seeing how much devastation he can create. And to that guy, you’re not safe. I don’t care where you are, you’re not safe. That you know, $200 that you’re gonna collect from this kid is not worth it. And I’m gonna say it’s not worth it from the ramifications that you’re gonna face, but it’s also it’s also not worth it. And consider consider the loss, consider the damage. And we’ve got to understand that there is a large body of people on this planet, and I’ve said this from day one, that are just evil. And they will not they will not consider the guy down the road, the family down the road, in their decisions. And so to them, um you’re not safe wherever you are, and I think this this proves that.
SPEAKER_02
It’s demonic, it’s it’s an evil, it’s a spiritual battle, right? Like like Satan comes to still kill and destroy, and we see that. He comes to still kill and destroy our kiddos, he’s coming after our kiddos.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02
What would you say to a teenager who is being sex torted? What would you say to them if you were able to actually speak to a young man in the situation and he was he was being terrorized?
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, number one, I think that it feels differently whenever you understand that it is a scam. Put it in the right perspective. When you think about these guys, it is it is the equivalent of you know them them calling your grandmother and pretending to be a movie star and wanting them to send you money. Wanted them to send them money. It it’s the equivalent of that. And so they’ve got a list of people they’re going down the line and they’re trying to scam. And you fall victim to a scam. It’s a financial scam. And 99% of the time, the minute you block and the minute you stop communicating, they’re gone to the next one on the list. And so it as a dad whose son didn’t understand that, Walker, he didn’t understand that it was something he could just walk away from. And he didn’t understand that 99% of the time they just quit. They don’t ever send you anything. It’s just to see if they can get you scared enough to send the money. That’s it. The second thing is I would tell you go to somebody quickly. There’s nobody in your circle of either parents or friends or coach or school teacher. There’s nobody in your sphere of people that have not experienced embarrassing, difficult situations like you’re in. Whether caught on tape, whether caught on video, or pictures. But we’re all we’re all in the same boat in terms of our sexuality, in terms of what we desire or we don’t desire. We’re all the same in that in that aspect. Variances, sure, but the general the general leanings, we’re all the same. So um I know that you would think that you’re the only person on this planet that’s experiencing this, but you’re not. Find somebody to talk to quickly and quick communicating, because it will most likely just go away. And that is a big one of the biggest frustrations for us, is that if Walker would have just stopped and just thought, and if he had ever heard that there was another dad out there somewhere telling this story that happened to their family, Walker would still be here. I know it.
SPEAKER_02
That’s what I see time and time again when we’re contacted by families that their kid woke them up in the middle of the night, they’re able to identify that they may not even they’ll say, It’s what happened to that boy. It’s what you were telling me about. And they’re able to identify it as a scam. And that is what is such a tragedy about Walker is that we didn’t know this existed back in 2022 when, and that’s why it was so important that I wanted you to share your story right away. Because I just was like, what in the world? I’ve never heard of this happening so fast. So we’re we’ve raised awareness, we’re getting laws passed, we’re we’re getting we’re holding predators responsible. You know, we’re getting them back here to face justice. We’re doing all these things, and I think it’s all a piece of the puzzle.
SPEAKER_02
But you know, at next talk, our goal is the family. The what can we do at home to protect our kids? Of course, we got to have the conversations because we know it can happen and we need to warn. Um, we also, in collaboration with you, created Walker’s Promise. Tell us why you’re passionate about that and why you join forces with us on rolling that out.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, I think that is probably as a family one of like the most practical things that can move the needle the most in terms of being protective. Is it 100% no? But you know, what I’ve said for day one is you know, had I known what I know now, Walker wouldn’t have had his phone at midnight. Does that prevent it altogether? No, it doesn’t. But um, you know, our our commitment when you sign Walker’s Promise, when you pledge that, um, it’s just look, you you don’t have to pledge it. I mean, it’s just it’s helpful helpful to us to know how many people we’re that we’re helping, put it to put it straight. I mean, it’s very encouraging for our family to know that somebody would go on your website and commit to Walker’s Promise and say that they will not allow, you know, digital technology in the bedroom or in the bathroom overnight or private places. That’s a very practical way. You know, a couple of things. I mean, one, it helps them get their sleep. You know, we’ve seen that over and over as they put they’re playing athletics, you know, they’re very engaged in athletics, they’re they’re having to they’re having to study, there’s you know, they’re all kinds of stresses during the day for these kids. And for them to come home and be on their phone until two o’clock in the morning, three o’clock in the morning, and have to get up and go to school the next morning, I mean, that’s a lot. That’d be that’s a lot for anybody. And so uh they’re all sleep deprived in that situation. And so to be productive, they need their sleep. Uh, but secondarily, you know, in the dark, by their self, you know, I think that there was this idea of Walker’s, you know, fear and not understanding what he was into until it was too late. He couldn’t bring himself to come in there and wake us up. I don’t understand that. And I, you know, one day when I see him again, I’m gonna we’ll have a maybe we will, maybe we won’t have a conversation about it, but um probably won’t matter at that point.
SPEAKER_02
But you’ll just be hugging your boy, Brian. You’re just gonna be hugging your boy. It’s not gonna matter.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, but the other thing I think is it starts whenever you when you take those devices as the parent, it resets the resets the dynamic of, okay, whose devices are they? Number one, they’re yours if you’re a parent. Um it sets the president precedent of if it’s mine, I have the right to investigate what you’re up to on. Versus if it’s always in their possession. I mean, we all can relate to, hey, let me see your phone. And the kid’s kind of like, you know, I’ll ult you have my phone. Well, why is that? Well, I mean, they’re they’ll tell them the things they talk about. Hey, that’s all fine. I mean, I’ve said it time and time again, you know, when I wasn’t around my parents, we would say stuff about our parents about whatever they did we had like about them for the day. Unfortunately for our kids, all that is in the digital world, it’s it’s there on that telephone. It’s it’s it’s recorded in some in some way. So they get this idea that it’s theirs. And and so, you know, that’s harder to do the further the older your kids are, and there’s been no restrictions, there’s been no accountability for the devices. But um, it is really important to set that proper expectation. And I think Walker’s Promise does that. I think it gives the gives the parent an opportunity to say, hey, I heard a podcast today, there was this man and lady on there talking about it, and they were talking about things that are very dangerous, and I’m concerned about the world you’re living in digitally. And so this is a new, this is this is a new thing we agreed to. I agree to do this, and we’re gonna do it. And so it sets that precedence, and I think it’s uh very practical. It’s not the only step, and it’s a very practical first step to a fanity being safer.
SPEAKER_02
Well, it’s it’s an extra barrier between your kid and a stranger, right? I mean, we we have to shift how we look at strangers. Gone are the days that we just have to worry about the Walmart parking lot and somebody snatching your kid. I mean, obviously we still worry about that, but but these predators are coming into our homes through the devices and they’re getting our kids in this dark moment and terrorizing them and manipulating them, and it’s so emotional. And if they don’t have the tools or know or have never heard of this, you can see where it would be overwhelming. It would be over overwhelming for me at my age if somebody had threatened me with something in the middle of the night. So it’s just one practical way to say no strangers in our kids, bedroom or bathroom. We’re just not going to do it.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, one thing that we’ve learned, um, you know, the way I’ve always told our story is that, you know, that night around midnight, Walker received that message. What we’ve learned since they’ve unsealed the case is that Walker actually received the message about two days prior. So you may see something, your listeners may see something in the press that says that they it had been going on for two days. It’s really not true. He had received the message two days prior, but he didn’t respond until that night. My point to tell you that there were two days where that message was on his phone where he hadn’t responded, maybe he hadn’t looked at it, maybe he looked at it, said, I probably shouldn’t respond to that. Not exactly sure what had happened in those two days, two to three days, I can’t remember exactly, but we do know that was the message was there two to three days prior to Walker responding to it. His response that night was the first communication. So we’re writing our story, it’s not misleading at all, it’s the same story. But the point I want to make is with that message there, as a parent, going back to Walker’s promise, if I had been doing my due diligence and you know taking that phone out, and I don’t look at our, I don’t, I don’t look at messages and stuff that often with our kids now, but it it there would have been an opportunity for me to find it, for me to see it potentially and say, okay, what’s up, what’s up with this? We don’t know this person, you know. And I I think as parents, there’s a balance between, you know, letting our kids have the privacy and keeping them safe. And so really where I want that marriage to be personally, I think it’s different for everybody and every family, but is just have good solid communication. I think when that phone comes to the parents every night, I think it it sets that first boundary for that.
SPEAKER_02
I know I’ve said this to you before, and I’ll say it again, it’s it’s not your fault. Like it’s it’s it’s Satan’s fault that used a predator halfway around the world to manipulate Walker in a it is not your fault. What I love about your story though is that you’re you’re saying this is a step. This is a step that you can take because of what we learned. We didn’t know about this danger before, and now we know, and this is a step you can take. So go sign this commitment that you’re gonna keep screens out of your child’s bedroom and bathroom. Brian, I I appreciate you sharing with us and giving us the details. You’ve taken us along on the journey with you. Uh, we prayed through your cancer diagnosis, your health. You’re you’re doing good, right?
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, we’re uh continue to pray. We’re uh we’re still there’s been no reoccurrence. I’m hesitant to say uh we’re cancer free, but I mean we don’t see any cancer. There’s been no since our we’re um about two and a half years since since any since we had any known cancer. Um, you know, I had colon cancer that had metastasized my liver, so it’s stage four cancer. Very scary diagnosis. Um they resectioned uh my liver and part of my colon and then did 12 rounds of chemotherapy. And since then, that was my treatment regimen. We’ve had there’s been no uh no elevated levels that would indicate cancer. They’ve seen nothing on any scans. Um so as far as we know right now, we don’t have any presence of cancer, and we’re just so thankful. I mean, just yeah, will it be that way forever? We’re living like we have today. You know, we we don’t know what tomorrow brings, but um for today it’s it’s it’s been very we went to Indy Anderson, I mean, just complete professionals, but the true physician physician is God. He’s you know, he’s taking us day by day. But again, we’d love we’d love for you to continue to pray because the real benchmark we’re kind of pushing for is five years, and but there’s a lot of life to live in between now and five years, so we’re gonna we’re gonna keep after it and just continue to pray.
SPEAKER_02
Well, keep us posted. We’re gonna keep praying. Do we know anything about an upcoming trial? Like when will we know a date of that?
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, so what they’re telling us now is currently um the the judge set a trial date of um October 19th, I believe. I mean the end the expectation is that’s all still very up in there. He’s got an attorney, and it I mean, he did plea enter a plea of plea of not guilty last week, and um, and so that that was part that we expected that. That wasn’t a surprise. Uh we expect his attorney to get the evidence um in discovery and decide, you know, what is he looking at, and then hopefully we’ll get some communication back then on whether we’re whether we’re going forward with a trial or he’s gonna try to plead guilty. And we’ll we’ve got a lot of questions still on whether how that looks.
SPEAKER_02
Well, keep us hosted and and we’re praying with you every step of the way, Brian.
SPEAKER_01
You got now, y’all, y’all rotten the level with us. So again, we love y’all and appreciate all you do.
SPEAKER_02
Appreciate you and Courtney so much and praying over your kids and everything, and uh just thank you.
SPEAKER_00
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