0:00:05 – Speaker 1
Welcome to nextTalk Radio with Mandy and Kim Every Saturday at 10am on AM 630 the word. Mandy is the author of Talk and Kim is the director of nextTalk, a non-profit organization helping parents cyber parent through open communication. Follow us on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter. Find our free video series and subscribe to our weekly podcast at NextTalkorg. Are you ready for the nextTalk?
0:00:32 – Speaker 2
On our last show we covered some of the key things to remember when covering the tough topic of divorce with your kids and within your family. We went from marriage shows, which are great. We love doing those shows, but the reality is that not everyone is in a healthy, stable marriage, and so we want to talk about all those different topics. Covering divorce is tough but important, and your kids are going to ask questions, so I’m glad we got to do that. That was a great show, and now we’re diving into yet another difficult topic.
0:00:59 – Speaker 3
Domestic abuse, and this one, guys, we had to bring in experts because we need some help on this one. We have Celeste Inman today from the Vine Wellness Group in San Antonio. Thanks for joining us, celeste. Thank you for having me. Yes, why don’t you tell us a little bit about you, your family? You’ve been in practice for how many years? You’ve got a wealth of knowledge you had to think about it.
0:01:22 – Speaker 2
Yes, she had to look like how many years? Ago.
0:01:25 – Speaker 4
It’s been 13 years since I’ve been in practice and have been with the Vine Wellness Group and private practice with Annie Byers and a licensed professional counselor and a registered play therapist. And actually where I got started was working at a domestic violence shelter and that is one of my passions that I absolutely love is working with this population. The information is just overwhelming to find out about, but also personally about myself. I have a husband of. I have to think about that one as well.
A long time 16 years great marriage and I have a 10-year-old daughter and a 5-year-old son and wonderful family, love family time and I love work as well.
0:02:06 – Speaker 3
Well, we’re really excited to have you here today. Thank you for taking time out of your busy schedule. I know this show is going to help so many people, you know. I think we should get right into it because I think there’s a lot to cover and we want to make sure we give enough time and stats tell us where we are with this, like, how big of a deal is this? It?
0:02:25 – Speaker 4
is a huge deal. It’s almost an epidemic, I’d have to say. I actually pulled a couple that are really just about everywhere, but pulled some from the Childhood Domestic Violence Association and then also from the National Coalition Against Domestic Violence. But what has not changed over the years that I’ve been doing this for the last 13, 14 years is the same statistic of one in every three person, or one in every three women, will be affected by domestic violence in their lifetime.
0:02:54 – Speaker 3
That is unbelievable.
0:02:55 – Speaker 4
Within the United States, every minute, 20 people are being abused, whether it’s verbal, emotional, physical, sexual any kind of abuse is all included in there. Every 20, every minute, Every minute, 20 people are being affected by abuse.
0:03:13 – Speaker 2
I was just going to say. I think a lot of the reason those stats are so high is once people start talking and explaining. I think there are people who don’t even realize that they’ve been in an abusive situation, and so we seem like, oh my goodness, that’s crazy. What if we think back? Some of us may have actually experienced it ourselves, Correct?
0:03:29 – Speaker 3
Well, and the other thing is, we’ve gotten good at wearing masks. Oh, yeah.
I tell my kids all the time you never know what’s going on behind closed doors at a person’s house and that’s why you have to love with grace and be kind to people, because you never know why a kid may be acting out at school or why they’re having these issues. Yeah, you know, because sometimes my kids are coming home and be like, oh my gosh, this kid, and I’m like, but you never know, like there could be so much going on at home.
And that’s causing him to act out wrong at school, so okay, so tell us some signs.
0:04:02 – Speaker 4
Signs. There are a lot of different signs within either the women or the person who is being abused. And then there’s also signs within the children, some signs to look for within either the woman or the person who is being abused. They’re going to isolate themselves. They’re going to give reasons or excuses as to why, very often, they can’t be involved in things. They’re going to have a low self-esteem.
The person that they’re with in that relationship is going to make all of their decisions for them and kind of decide who they can spend time with or when they can do things, and it really takes control in that relationship. You’re also going to see that they’re going to have either a lot of physical problems and sometimes they become even chronic, like a lot of depression. Anxiety is going to also be there Because they feel trapped, they do and hopeless Right, because they are so isolated and they don’t know sometimes where to turn to, who to talk to and then sometimes too, to be able to cope with that in their own ways. Unfortunately, they will turn to the unhealthy ways of coping, of addictions, or because there’s no other way out and they don’t know what to do.
0:05:11 – Speaker 2
And there’s the psychological side of that too, I’m sure you can speak into that where women believe, like I deserve this, and so they get caught up in that cycle, or it’s cyclical in their family history, so it’s what they’ve seen, grown up with and are used to, so they think this is normal. Correct, this is normal.
0:05:27 – Speaker 4
And they do feel that that’s what a relationship should look like and that’s how I should be treated, and so they do get into that, where they kind of justify and that’s why he’s doing what he’s doing, or I deserved it. Yes.
0:05:42 – Speaker 3
Or all guys are like this. I mean, I’ve heard that one. Which is not true guys.
0:05:47 – Speaker 4
That’s not true, that’s not, it loves, not supposed to hurt.
0:05:50 – Speaker 3
Love is not supposed to hurt. That’s so good. Celeste, what about talking to kids about this subject? So say, you have a marriage and there’s abuse going on and maybe you have left and you were walking through that. Like, how do you talk to your kids about this? Like, what are some key things that you could say? I mean, I’m assuming be honest, but in their terms.
0:06:14 – Speaker 4
Give us some insight on that it’s tough with children because you have to remember that even though the parent who was doing the abusive behaviors is still their parent, and so they have a lot of ambivalence. I love my parent, but it also hurts when they hurt my other parent, and so you have to kind of walk that fine line that is still their parent, but kind of explaining it more factual Love is not supposed to hurt and that was not okay for me to be treated that way, or we had to separate so that we could all be safe that right now the other parent needs to have that time out to kind of work through things or find other ways to either. It’s okay to be angry, but we need to find those healthy ways to express anger and the appropriate ways to express anger, and they need to work on those issues.
0:07:01 – Speaker 2
Yeah, speaking of the children in this situation, if we go back a little bit to the signs, what if the kids have been a part of abuse? What are some of those signs that we’re looking for?
0:07:10 – Speaker 4
A lot of signs you might see initially might be more in the classroom. They’re gonna have a hard time focusing and concentrating because they’re constantly worried about what’s going on at home how is my mom doing, how is my dad doing, and so they’re so focused on that that they really don’t focus well at school. So their grades tend to drop or they’re gonna regress in other areas. If they’re younger, you might see it come out in anger and more aggressive towards others, or they might even have again the high anxiety, depression and they’re not gonna be able to sleep well. So they might be falling asleep in class and then also noticing too have they been neglecting themselves and taking care of themselves, or eating wise? How are they doing with eating?
0:07:51 – Speaker 3
You know you said something that just triggered something in me, because we do a lot of shows on bullying and you know a lot of the kids who may be hitting other kids, being mean to other kids, saying mean things to other kids, may be seeing this at home and they’re modeling it out.
0:08:09 – Speaker 4
Very, very true.
0:08:10 – Speaker 3
And it’s such a fine line because we must hold the bullies accountable and they must learn not to do it, but at the same time also seeing the cycle that’s got the bully in that place Right?
0:08:20 – Speaker 4
I think that’s an important question to try to find out too, for the bully is where is that coming from? Why are they bullying? Is there something else going on at home, or is it due to other factors that they’re experiencing? So that can uncover?
0:08:33 – Speaker 2
And I know you mentioned that you know there’s so many different layers to abuse verbal abuse, physical abuse, and then there’s sexual abuse. I’ve heard over time too that sometimes kids act out they’re over sexualized, and that’s another sign to look for.
0:08:48 – Speaker 4
It is Either by the words that they’re using, how they’re acting or the knowledge that they have if they are witnessing something that’s going on at home or again. The statistics also will state that the children that are in homes living in homes where there is violence, they are seven times more likely to be abused themselves and that includes sexual abuse as well Because they think it’s normal, yes, they think it’s like normal.
That’s helpful, yes, and so they end up acting out on others, because that’s what you know. If the person I know and I trust is doing these behaviors to me, that must be what the right thing to do.
0:09:23 – Speaker 2
And it’s so strange how that can be so very subtle and acceptable, socially acceptable.
You know, I remember a woman coming up to me at one of our events and I commented on her pants and I said you know, those pants are so cute and she said something to degree of well, my husband said like I looked like a fat cow this morning and I thought that’s. You know, I can’t imagine my husband saying anything like that. But in her world she laughed it off and I said, oh, my goodness, I’m so sorry. And she’s like, oh no, we just joke like that, but in her world that was okay, they minimize it. They minimize it and that becomes the standard in their family and that’s what their kids are seeing and learning, and then that’s what we see at school, and then the cycle continues, the cycle continues. So it can be something so socially acceptable. And just kind of a jab to you know, being sexually abused, being hit and all of that falls under that abuse banner and those comments, the comments that are made just to jab even with this self-esteem yes, it’s just.
0:10:21 – Speaker 4
They tend to go ahead and start accepting that that I’m not worth it or I’m not pretty enough or I’m not good enough.
0:10:27 – Speaker 2
So sometimes it takes that person kind of standing up or stating that no, that’s not normal, that’s not normal, that’s not okay, right. And so what’s that I mean for you know, from your perspective, what does that look like? Is that a good idea? Or do you think people are generally? Do they receive that well when they’re going through something? Is that the right approach?
0:10:48 – Speaker 4
It’s hard for them to receive that. But it’s so important for us to stand up and say those things that you know what that really isn’t normal and you are beautiful. Or I would hope that you’d be able to accept the compliment and just really think about it. Or, and you know, if we see kids joking around that we sometimes even step out and say you know that may you may have laughed about that, but I wonder if that really kind of hurts.
0:11:09 – Speaker 2
Yeah, pointing it out.
0:11:10 – Speaker 3
You know, one of the things as my teen daughter has gotten older that we’ve talked about a lot is this idea of when a boy likes you, he’ll be mean to you, you know like.
He’ll make fun of you, he’ll tickle you, he’ll steal your back pound and chew in the arm, dance Little things like that, and we have had a lot of conversations about that, because she said to me one day mom, that’s not a good message for sending to kids when we jokingly say, oh, he must like you. And I found myself doing that Like we grew up in an era.
0:11:37 – Speaker 2
This is socially acceptable things.
0:11:38 – Speaker 3
Yeah, and and. So we’ve had a lot of conversations about like it’s not okay, Like if a boy likes you, he shouldn’t be mean to you Right.
0:11:46 – Speaker 4
We start to get desensitized to so many things as what becomes the norm, and I think that is so important to have those open conversations with our kiddos as to you know what this is, what a healthy relationship should look like. This is how we should treat others, and being kind and caring and loving because, again, love isn’t supposed to hurt. And so you know, even comments, the smallest comment, can hurt.
And it’s not supposed to, or having those healthy boundaries and teaching them what their boundaries are. What are our values, what are we? Where do we stand? And not let others cross over and say that was you know. To be assertive, and say that’s not okay. And so helping them to gain that confidence, to be assertive.
0:12:23 – Speaker 3
Yes, I love that. You know, we had a meme posted on social media today and I don’t even know which of our amazing volunteers said it, but but she said you are teaching your kids how to treat you and I thought that is so true, and it corresponded with the day we were doing the domestic abuse story, so that was kind of funny, but that’s a great point it is.
0:12:43 – Speaker 4
That is something I always, when I’m working with parents that are struggling within a marriage, or if I’m working with a woman in her marriage and trying to decide what to do, I also bring up if they have children or if they’re going to have children. Is this the way you would want your child to grow up? And then the relationship you want your child to be in? Because what you’re modeling right now is what they’re going to follow and the kind of relationship they’re going to seek and find that is so good, celeste, so good.
0:13:11 – Speaker 3
I mean, even those of us who aren’t in a domestic abuse situation like we need to remember that how we’re resolving conflict with our spouse in a healthy way, our kids are seeing that Is this the kind of relationship we want them to be in? Right, that’s so good.
0:13:25 – Speaker 2
We talked to our boys about that just this weekend because we have two older boys and our daughters the youngest, and so there’s a lot of rough housing and jabs and all that kind of stuff and we had the conversation with them this weekend because they were especially wily. You know what I mean. Just sometimes they’re in that mood and they’re difficult and they’re fighting.
They’re pushing each other’s buttons, pushing each other’s buttons. You know sibling rivalry and we were talking to them about two things. We sat down last night we were doing a little devotion around the tree and it was like a sweet moment. We said you know, one thing someone told me that has stuck with me is are you treating your strangers? Are you treating strangers better than your own family? Oh, that’s so good.
Because you wouldn’t hit your family or grab a toy out of their hand or push them or make a jab at a stranger, so why would you do that to someone that you love deeply and care about? One and two we were telling our boys you are the first example. You and daddy are the first example to Sophia about what it means to be a man and how to be treated by a boy, and if you’re touching her in a rough way, that she’s gonna get used to that feeling and then that’s gonna be okay for her. What a great conversation it was. You know it was tough because they’re still young boys, they’re little boys, but we gotta start early. We do. We have to set that standard, young, so that it becomes the standard for them and for our family and for our kids.
0:14:40 – Speaker 4
And I think with these messages we can’t say them over and over enough. The more that we say it, the more that they’re gonna remember it At different ages and stages.
0:14:47 – Speaker 3
Exactly. If you’re just now tuning in, this is nextTalk Radio with Mandy and Kim every Saturday at 10 am on AM 630, the word nextTalk Radio is listeners supported. Everything we do at our nonprofit to keep kids safe online is accomplished through your donations To support our organization. Go to nexttalkorg and click on give. I’m sorry.
0:15:11 – Speaker 2
Mandy, you’re hitting me over here and it’s a show about domestic abuse.
0:15:16 – Speaker 3
Sorry guys, I actually just blew my hand up and hit Kim and I did not get it.
0:15:20 – Speaker 2
Okay, girl, I forgive you. I forgive you. We’ll talk later about your problems. Yes, sorry, Exactly Today we have Celeste Inman here from the Vine Wellness Group, an incredible group. You and your partner I’ve just really blessed our community and are such a great resource. Just tell us really quickly how people can get in contact with you and what kind of services you offer.
0:15:41 – Speaker 4
We provide services starting as young as age two for with play therapy, and then we go all the way up until there’s no ending age 102. Yes, we will provide services all the way up. Wonderful, we work with children, adolescents, individual adults. We’ll do premarital, marital and everything in between groups for any. We have also addictions that we have an LCDC counselor on staff as well, and so we provide for so many different reasons and situations that people struggle, face with. And so you can go to wwwthevinewellnesscom. And that was the T-H-E. Sometimes it sounds like divine.
0:16:23 – Speaker 2
Yeah, it’s not true. Yeah, the Vine, the Vine, yes, awesome.
0:16:29 – Speaker 4
And it provides a lot more detailed information on the website there too, Well, we really appreciate what you guys are doing.
0:16:33 – Speaker 3
For those of you who don’t know, annie did our Celeste’s partner did our divorce show and our cutting show and I speak with Annie and Celeste a lot. They’ve been great to speak with because they are the experts on this journey, kind of validating what I’m saying to moms, what I’m hearing from my mom rumors over here. And they’re like yes, this is all happening.
0:16:53 – Speaker 1
0:16:54 – Speaker 4
And sometimes stats don’t even keep up with because things are moving so fast now with technology, they do, yeah, and then sometimes the stats don’t get out until you’re two later, and I think they’ve already changed?
0:17:04 – Speaker 2
Yeah, absolutely. Well, talking about domestic violence today and abuse in all different forms and we talked about some of the signs and how important it is to actually say something what about getting help If you’re on the other side of that and you realize, okay, this is a problem, I am experiencing this. What now?
0:17:20 – Speaker 4
I think it’s so important to maybe start with friends where you might feel comfortable just to kind of confide in it and let somebody know what you’ve been dealing with, and then they can even just hear you out and listen and maybe confirm and validate what you’re going through is not okay, yeah, and then that or even two. If you just have questions that you want to ask somebody anonymously of what you’re going through and experiencing, you can call the National Domestic Abuse Hotline and that’s 1-800-799-7233. And you can always talk to somebody anonymously there as well. But I think just talking about it and kind of letting somebody know that it’s happening is the first step to kind of admitting and not just justifying or minimizing the situation of what you’re going through.
0:18:09 – Speaker 3
So I have a question for you. Say, a friend comes to me and says I think I’m being abused and I need help. What should I do as a friend, Like I know, listen for sure and be there for her, but should I get her into a counselor? Is there somewhere that I need to report? What do I need to do?
0:18:28 – Speaker 4
You want to recommend maybe speaking with a professional, whether it fits over the phone with a hotline, or if it is with somebody a counselor in an office somewhere or maybe even reaching out to the church, because sometimes the church is another great place to start too. If you do have concerns about safety, if the kids are experiencing it and actually witnessing and seeing it happen, or if there is potential you have concerns of safety for the children as well, you should make a report to Child Protective Services, and again, you can do that anonymously as well. But you don’t ever wanna say right away that you need to leave. Yes, that would be probably, depending upon how severe the situation is. That might be something they need to consider, but a lot of times they’re not ready to hear that yet, and they’re overwhelmed right now, so they just it’s steps.
It is small steps and it just begins with listening and kind of repeating what you’re hearing and validating their emotions and feelings and that really the situation they’re not in is not okay, and so kind of talking about that and then maybe little by little, helping them develop a safety plan. What are some things that they can start doing to stay safe? And trying to decide as to what they need to be doing and just talking that through, not giving them so many recommendations other than safety or seeking extra professional help, but being that listening error.
0:19:47 – Speaker 2
Because truly and I think people who’ve never been in a domestic violence situation you think, well, they should know, they should just say something, they should get out of there, and that’s not the right approach.
Necessarily, you don’t know where they’re coming from and what their state of mind is and we’re gonna speak into that in a moment but the fact that they’re saying out loud is a huge first step. It is a big step and we need to validate that and encourage them. So on the other side of that, people who’ve never had any experience with this and they’re thinking why would someone stay in that situation? Can you speak into that a little?
0:20:16 – Speaker 4
maybe. Sure, it’s very difficult for those women and men who are experiencing it because, first off, they did fall in love with that other person, so they truly do love that person, and sometimes they feel they’ve made a commitment and so I need to follow through with my commitment. I can’t give up on this. Sometimes some myths are too within the Christian realm that if I’ve married this person, divorce is not okay. Yes, and so they have a hard time with that.
0:20:42 – Speaker 3
And you know anybody who is listening. God does not intend for you to be in an abused marriage. That’s not what God intends for marriage between a man and a woman. No, he wants healthy boundaries for us. He does. The husband is supposed to love and respect his wife as if it’s his own body. That is how a man is supposed to treat a woman. That is biblical Correct.
0:21:06 – Speaker 4
Yeah that. And then also she wants to believe that every time after it’s kind of the cycle with the abuse when it happens, there’s the tension phase and then there’s the buildup and the abuse and then they kind of go through a honeymoon stage where everything’s okay and that’s where he makes the promises. I’m so sorry. I’ll change, I’ll do better and she wants to believe that.
And she wants to believe that he’ll change or that she can do more to change him. Yes, and really that’s not our responsibility and we can’t do that. Only the person who’s struggling with those wrong choices needs to make those changes.
0:21:37 – Speaker 3
So let me ask you this so say there’s a married couple and there wasn’t a real history of abuse as far as huge red flags before, but there is an issue later and, due to whatever, stress or PTSD because of a job or whatever, something ignites and there is an anger outburst and there is something that crosses the line. What should that person do as far as? Is that a time when the man and the woman, kind of like you said before, have a timeout, kind of separate, and each get help before they make decisions about their marriage?
0:22:16 – Speaker 4
That kind of thing. I think that’s very important is to kind of take a break and to really get the professional help to work on their own struggles that they’re having, to be able to identify what that is what they need to do differently and then hopefully be able to come back together to work on those together.
0:22:29 – Speaker 3
then at that point, Because sometimes you know I’m 40, sometimes in life you know you’ve been with somebody and they’ve not. But then life gets you down and something happens to that person that makes them snap in a way that you’ve not seen before.
0:22:44 – Speaker 4
Stressors from work stressors from an experience on the job or Medical issues Medical yes.
0:22:50 – Speaker 2
Yes, I remember watching a documentary on car accident victims who had some brain trauma and became incredibly violent and abusive after that, people who had never had any sign of that before. So you just never know, right.
0:23:05 – Speaker 3
And we want to love those people with grace the people who are also doing the abusers, because again there’s something. Why are they doing it? We got to get to the why and they could get help and they could get healthy. But they need to separate until both parties kind of work on themselves.
0:23:20 – Speaker 4
Right. They need to be in their own safe situation, safe environments, to be able to focus on themselves and work on that, because sometimes, when that abuse is going on, things are too heated and people can’t be focused on what they need to be focusing on to work on those issues.
0:23:34 – Speaker 3
And if there’s kids involved, they’re watching.
0:23:35 – Speaker 4
They’re watching how you’re coping. They’re exposed to it all.
0:23:38 – Speaker 3
And even though this may be the one time you snapped in your whole life, your kids saw it, and so it becomes normal if that continues, right, if they see that, oh, it was swept under a rug and nothing was done about it.
0:23:49 – Speaker 4
Oh, then that’s how I can deal with all my other issues too. Oh, I’m so moved.
0:23:52 – Speaker 2
The sweeping Ugh. So good, it’s the last. And so let’s say you’re in a healthy marriage and there is no abuse. Is this something we need to be talking about to our kids?
0:24:02 – Speaker 4
We definitely do. We need to go ahead and even have those healthy relationships with our kiddos as they’re growing up, have the mommy son dates and have the daddy daughter dates to build their confidence and again just what those relationships should look like male, female and they can build their confidence that I’m loved and accepted for who I am, so that they’re also not seeking that. Before they need to seek those kind of lovely relationships, they’re getting it at home from their parents and then later on, as I get older, then I can find those other love relationships as well. But to have that confidence and to know what those healthy relationships look like, they’re getting that at home through their parents. But then again, too, that everything is being explained through that open communication as to what relationships should look like and how they should be treated Absolutely.
0:24:48 – Speaker 3
Celeste, thank you for coming on the show today. Again, you are from the Vine Wellness Group. You can find them online on Facebook. Your phone number is your office phone number 210-490.
0:25:04 – Speaker 4
I just went blank.
0:25:06 – Speaker 2
It happens to the best of us, we’ll put it on a meme and put it on our social media.
0:25:09 – Speaker 3
We will. And they can find you on your website at thevinewellnesscom com yes, and for you who are not local, the National Domestic Violence Hotline 1-800-799-7233. Celeste, thank you for helping us with the nextTalk about divestment priorities.
0:25:29 – Speaker 4
Thank you so much for having me, thank you.
0:25:32 – Speaker 1
Thanks for joining us on nextTalk Radio with Mandy and Kim every Saturday at 10 AM on AM 630, the Word. You are not alone trying to figure out how to parent in this digital world. We are here with practical solutions to help you. Follow us on Facebook, instagram and Twitter. Find our free video series and podcast at nexttalkorg. Are you ready for the nextTalk?
Transcribed by https://podium.page